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<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic">Fred</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic">I don't have a count on the number of times
I've been to the UK. I am sure it's more than a dozen but probably a bit
less than your count. No matter. Have been there enough to form a
pretty good view of the place. And that includes Scotland, Wales, the
Island of Wight (shouldn't that be Dwight?), and the Isle of Man. I've
also been to Ireland but not yet to Northern Ireland.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic">I would have no problem at all in going back,
although with limited time and budget for travel, there are other places I would
opt for first. Algeria and Tunisia are high on the list for 2014, for
example. But if I had a chance to go via London and spend a day or two in
old Blighty, I'd gladly take it. More likely, though, I'll go via
Germany.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Century Gothic">Dwight</FONT></DIV>
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style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=fwschneider@comcast.net href="mailto:fwschneider@comcast.net">Fred
Schneider</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=pittsburgh-railways@mailman.dementix.org
href="mailto:pittsburgh-railways@mailman.dementix.org">Western PA Trolley
discussion</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, November 12, 2013 9:43
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [PRCo] More of London
(2)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I've been in Britain a total of 18 times, Dwight. A
couple of them were tours run by an assistant priest in an Episcopal church
and one of those we went along to help chaperone a bunch of high school
kids. On tours like that you can rapidly become "all cathedraled
out." I also had a few where I wandered by train. But
most were those where I rented a car at Heathrow or Gatwick and just followed
the open road, making up my mind from day to day or hour-by-hour where I
wanted to go. I love that free and easy way of traveling
never
knowing where the next hotel or bed & breakfast will be until you have
checked in. Of course, when you are driving, you schedule
London first or last for when you don't have a car because you really don't
want a car there. Yes, I've driven across London without even
opening a road map but that was in the days before congestion taxes and fining
you if you had not paid the tax. It's much easier to get a black
cab and let him show you London. <BR><BR>Driving on the
other side of the road is uncomfortable the first time you do it.
However, after about ten thousand miles driving on the other side of the road,
I found it becomes instinctive. When the brain senses you are
looking out over the right side of the hood, the left hand automatically falls
on the "shifter" and the eyes look right first in a roundabout.
The only problem I ever had was with a Ford Focus (aka Fuckus) because they
didn't have room to get the pedals where they belonged on the right hand
version and you could move your foot to where you thought it should be for
braking and then find, oh shit, it's still over the throttle.
<BR><BR>Restaurant rules have changed considerably in Britain.
When I first went there, the nation had very stringent rules on when
restaurants and pubs were permitted to open and when they were required to
close. If you missed the breakfast or lunch hours, you essentially
had two choices
. find a grocer or a McDonalds and frankly, the former was
probably better than the latter. I am not sure what has happened
could easily find out if I wanted to
but I suspect allowing places like
Burger King and McDonalds and motorway rest stop restaurants to be open at all
hours forced parliament to make changes in the rules for other
restaurants.<BR><BR>But the flip side of that coin is that popping into a
local grocery store (and I do not mean a Tesco or Sainsbury supermarket but a
small local grocer) might just afford an opportunity for a conversation and
another learning experience. I remember a small town grocer in the
south of England who told me that if the Monks came back (the ones Henry VIII
expelled in 1544 or so), all they would have to do is remove their television
antennas to make them feel at home. <BR><BR>On Nov 12, 2013, at
7:15 PM, Dwight Long wrote:<BR><BR>> <BR>> Fred<BR>> <BR>> I took
the day flight over once and after getting from Heathrow to my hotel near
Victoria, went down to the local to do as you say do in your third
paragraph. I had one beer and the man cried "Hours" and that was all
there was to that!<BR>> <BR>> In Scotland if you are a registered guest
at a hotel and they have a bar you can imbibe at any hour you choose.<BR>>
<BR>> Dwight<BR>> ----- Original Message ----- <BR>>
From: Fred Schneider <BR>> To: Western PA Trolley discussion ; John
Swindler <BR>> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 6:45 PM<BR>>
Subject: Re: [PRCo] More of London (2)<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> The
Anglophyles in the group will have won when one of the rest of you writes that
we got through to me and I just had a great vacation there.
<BR>> <BR>> And "great" doesn't mean a commercial tour where the
only thing you understand is that the tour guide ripped you off taking you to
stores that give her and the coach driver a 20% rake on all they sell to the
group and you come home realizing that the only thing you really learned is
that the American on the bus in front of you needed a haircut.
<BR>> <BR>> Great means you met some locals, added some names to
the Christmas card list, maybe went to the trolley museum at Crich and wound
up spending the evening after the museum closed in a local pub eating and
downing spirits with a gang from the museum. <BR>>
<BR>> But it is dangerous
<BR>> <BR>> You make friends
in other nations and you find yourself reading their newspapers
too. <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> On Nov 12, 2013, at
1:03 AM, John Swindler wrote:<BR>> <BR>>> <BR>>> <BR>>>
For those not familiar with class 9F:<BR>>> <BR>>> <A
href="http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=evening+star+locomotive&FORM=VIRE3#view=detail&mid=4BC9B850653BAEB91EC84BC9B850653BAEB91EC8">http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=evening+star+locomotive&FORM=VIRE3#view=detail&mid=4BC9B850653BAEB91EC84BC9B850653BAEB91EC8</A><BR>>>
<BR>>> <BR>>> The end of main line steam in U.K. was 1967, and the
consensus was that only a few locomotives were preserved. And then a
scrap yard was discovered in Barry, Wales. Somewhat fascinating story,
but goes beyond theme of this list. <BR>>> <BR>>>
<BR>>> <BR>>> <BR>>>> From: <A
href="mailto:dwightlong@verizon.net">dwightlong@verizon.net</A><BR>>>>
To: <A
href="mailto:pittsburgh-railways@mailman.dementix.org">pittsburgh-railways@mailman.dementix.org</A><BR>>>>
Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2013 23:36:40 -0500<BR>>>> Subject: Re: [PRCo] More
of London (2)<BR>>>> <BR>>>> <BR>>>>
Fred<BR>>>> <BR>>>> A minor correction. The last
British steam locomotive built for main line service (prior to Tornado) was
Evening Star, a 2-10-0 and it was built in 1960. It is now at the museum
in York.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> Dwight<BR>>>> -----
Original Message ----- <BR>>>> From: Fred Schneider <BR>>>>
To: Western PA Trolley discussion <BR>>>> Sent: Monday, November 11,
2013 10:40 PM<BR>>>> Subject: [PRCo] More of London
(2)<BR>>>> <BR>>>> <BR>>>> This is only for those
who care. The others may delete it. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> One knows only who really loves the same thing he or she does
and also who despises the subject. Those who like it might tell
you. Those who violently disagree generally make sure you
know. Those who waver to either side
you sometimes know while the
masses in the middle will never say anything. This is for
those who might care. <BR>>>> <BR>>>> There are
two guys on his list whom I know to be Anglophiles. I once told
Derrick that I had done something so crazy as having dashed off to London,
England, with my wife merely to attend the theater on Saturday night.
Mr. Brashear advised me that he had once done the same. The other
one I know would be John Swindler, whose Mum followed his Dad home from
England at the end of World War II. John still has cousins in
Britain. Dwight Long has been there a few times.
And I've been there so many times (18 at last count) that when I looked at a
travel video of one town two weeks ago, I got that same feeling we all get
when we come home from vacation
the "it's great to be home"
feeling. By the way, I get that I'm home feeling in many places
ranging from where I live to Pittsburgh or Los Angeles or some English or
German or Swiss towns. It comes from wandering.
<BR>>>> <BR>>>> Beside John and Derrick, some of the rest of
you might enjoy some of these videos and the attached narrative and this is
for you.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> My first visit to Great Britain
occurred in August 1959 when I had a one day escape from an army troop ship
docked at Southampton.<BR>>>> Because I knew from an American railfan
friend that London Underground was still running steam locomotives on the
Metropolitan Division northwest of Rickmansworth, I escaped from the tour and
went searching for these 1896 teakettles. Back then the we could
ride behind one of the electric engines in this video from Baker St. out to
Rickmansworth and behind steam beyond. I sniffed soft coal smoke
all afternoon. (To put it into perspective, a few weeks before I had
been to the opening of the Riverside line in Boston.) <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> The original Circle Line tube was opened by the Metropolitan
as a steam underground railway. Can you imagine all that dirt
underground? Well, if you look at the stations today, all the air
vents that allowed the smoke to escape have been bricked up. But early
in 2013 they ran some steam excursions with Metropolitan number 1 and one of
those electric engines (the Sarah Siddons) which I rode behind in 1959
the
electric was doing most of the work.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> But
there were not options when it opened. In 1868 steam was modern.
We would not have successful electric technology for another 22 years and MU
operation for another 30 years. In fact it was extend under steam
multiple times until 1884 and was not electrified until 1905. (See
for history: <A
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_line_(London_Underground">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_line_(London_Underground</A>)<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> And here is the first video
.<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg4GY9aKfRE">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg4GY9aKfRE</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Now the punch line
I was standing at Baker Street the
following year (1960) when a Metropolitan guard came up and started to
chat. When it came time for him to leave, he grabbed me by the arm and
pushed me up into the cab of one of those old electric engines like Sarah
Siddons and I had a free ride out to Rickmansworth and back. Then
I spent the rest of the evening with him chatting in a local pub and trying to
make like I enjoyed warm ale. Turns out I think he was
attracted to how I had mounted two cameras side-by-side to take both slides
and negatives. He had been trained as a photographer in New York City but
could not find job when he returned to London so he wound up working for
London Transport. <BR>>>> <BR>>>> And another
nice flick of the Tube in London. Unlike New York, Chicago, Boston
and Philadelphia, London has had a zone fare system for as long as I've going
over there and that goes back to the pounds, shillings and pence
days. Can you imagine looking at the change in your hand and
telling if its correct
12 pence to the shillings, 20 shillings to the
pound? They also had half pence. (A
quarter pence was called a farthing so that a haypenny was two
farthings.) They actually had some children's tickets on the tube that
ended in half pence back then. It only took a few weeks
before that came naturally but I was 20 then. It probably wouldn't be
that easy at 73. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_olfhN3elog">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_olfhN3elog</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> In case you are confused by the multiple rails, LT has
separate positive and negative power rails in addition to the two running
rails. I think they have the ability to switch polarity so do not
assume either one is the hot rail. You might have a standard but
if the insulation fails on one, you could easily reverse polarity.
The national railroad network, on the other hand, uses only one power
rail.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> My next thought was to remind people of
what it was like in World War II, when the tubes were used as bomb
shelters. I started looking to see what might have been on
line. Here is a great 1941 educational film on keeping the system
running in war time. You say, 1941 and wartime? Yes, they
were at war long before we were
England and Germany were at war since Sept.,
1939. Much of the equipment in this film was still running
when I first got there in 1959. By the way
you see
buses in the heart of the city. London never had trams in the
heart of the city. They came only to the perimeter.
All the northern tram routes were gone by the time this film was made in
1941. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH2ZC9rbxSw">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH2ZC9rbxSw</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Perhaps the best tram film I ever saw from London was this
commercial film made in the last week of service in 1952. It was
once pulled for copyright infringement and now I found it again buried under
the heading "British Transport Films." Before it gets yanked again,
enjoy, if you will, "The Elephant Never Forgets." It's a reference to an
intersection in the south of London
think Elephant and
Castle. I love the older couple riding the top deck, maybe
because I have fond memories of viewing downtown Glasgow from the top deck of
a tram. And John Krish, the man who photographed this, was
fired for taking it
he was told only to photograph the chairman of London
Transport shaking hands with the last tram driver. He was told not to
make a 10 minute film. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rc9gtJndKE4">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rc9gtJndKE4</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Unfortunately, there is no easy way to find videos that show
people camped in the underground stations to avoid the Blitzkrieg in 1940 or
1941. We didn't have high speed movie films or digital cameras
then. There are still pictures out there. Can you
imagine thousands upon thousands of people who survived because the slept on
the concrete station platforms underground? There are many films
of the bombing of London on YouTube under keywords like Blitzkrieg or Blitz of
London or Battle of London but nothing that really shows how the transit
system was damaged. (Now, a lot of the items out there are
copyrighted
someone puts it on YouTube illegally and it disappears a few
months later when it is discovered
the good stuff might have been there and
is gone.) <BR>>>> <BR>>>> How many of us even
know today that the song lyrics, "and Jimmy will go to sleep in his own little
room again" referred to all the English kids who were sent to the country or
even to other nations to get away from the bombs during the war?
By the way, the "Forces Sweetheart," Vera Lynn, is still alive at age
96.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwtW2Lx5Vwc">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwtW2Lx5Vwc</A>
<BR>>>> <BR>>>> Southwest of "The City" is a place called
Clapham Junction where two railroads, the one that built Victoria Station and
the one whose home was Waterloo Station crossed. It is still one of
those places where you can commonly photograph two or three or four trains all
moving at the same time. This should give you some idea what I
meant in the previous e-mail that the Underground isn't important south of the
Thames; instead its the national network rail that fills the
void. I've been to both places and Clapham actually
makes Jamaica on the Long Island dull by comparison. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjgoL0TryA8">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjgoL0TryA8</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> And, as of 2012, there is a second circle line called the
London Overground
sort of like we might have a second Beltway around a
city. The London Overground is made up of national railroad
network lines:<BR>>>> <BR>>>>
<A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YqsdXXbwOI">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YqsdXXbwOI</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> This link is specifically for John Swindler, who did sail
with his Mum on the Queen Elizabeth (or maybe it was the Queen Mary) to see
Grandmum. It has a great picture of a boat train leaving the dock
at Southampton with a "Battle of Britain" class Pacific up front and the Queen
sitting at anchor. That particular locomotive was erected in
December 1948 and ran until 1967; RMS Queen Mary made its final crossing the
following year. <BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://cruiselinehistory.com/boat-trains-to-southampton-from-cunard-lines-to-the-rms-titanic-and-the-ss-united-states/">http://cruiselinehistory.com/boat-trains-to-southampton-from-cunard-lines-to-the-rms-titanic-and-the-ss-united-states/</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> Most of you remember Chicago as a city with almost more
mainline train stations than you could count
Union, Central, LaSalle,
Dearborn, Northwestern, Grand Central. Well, London was the same
kind of place but with even more stations. The railroads were not
unified into British Railways until 1948 and some of them were merged
earlier. But most of the stations remain today.
Paddington was Great Western's station in 1854 and Isambard Kingdom Brunnel's
statue is still prominent there. Euston dates back to 1837 and
served the London and Birmingham Railway originally and eventually the London,
Midland and Scottish. St. Pancras, right next to King's Cross, was
built in 1866 and served trains to the Midlands. Today it also
handles the Eurostar services to Paris and Brussels which circle the city on
new track. King's Cross goes back to 1852 and is home today to the
East Coast mainline to Scotland. Victoria opened in 1860 and
served four companies on the south. Waterloo dates to 1848 for
trains to the southwest. Charing Cross opened in the financial district
in 1864 and allowed trains ending at London Bridge to cross the river into the
City. Liverpool Street in the east handles trains going out
into the Fen country
if you take a boat train to Holland, you use it and it
goes back to 1875. And all these places are still open. And there
are a few minor places like Marylebone. There are five
terminals in about two miles along Euston St / Marylebone Road across the
north side of the city! <BR>>>> <BR>>>> And when
Mr. Swindler and I were first there, the southern ones were mostly third rail
or steam and the northern stations were almost all steam.
Great memories. <BR>>>> <BR>>>> My arrival in
London in 1959 was a Waterloo Station. Here is a stop motion film
of Waterloo Station in the rush hour 40 years ago. What's happened
since then? The traffic has gotten heavier and the old compartmented
stock is gone. You want that last phrase in American
English? British Railways had a lot of rolling stock with ten seat
compartments, each with doors on both sides. It has all been
scrapped due to the inherent hazards of being mugged or robbed or assaulted
(sexually or otherwise) if you wound up in a compartment with the wrong
person.<BR>>>> <BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPIaG644jsI">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPIaG644jsI</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> And a cluster of high definition scenes in King's Cross,
Euston, St. Pancras and Paddington<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnFuaDntIbw">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnFuaDntIbw</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> And if anyone has the time waste, here is an hour-long film
of steam in Britain, remastered from 8 mm films taken in the early 1960s
the
time I remember. The last steam engines were delivered in 1958, a
year before I first went there. The last fires were dropped about
eight years later (maybe nine) except for more tourist railroads than you will
anywhere else. Yes, it was a different world from here
vacuum
brakes back then. Most trains were so light that very few engines
had stokers. A fitted freight had brakes on all
cars. They had compartmented carriages (not coaches).
The engines didn't need headlights because, except for one grade crossing, the
entire network was fenced and gated. But the steam engines still sounded
like steam engines.<BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <A
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXw_cQbr6Do">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXw_cQbr6Do</A><BR>>>>
<BR>>>> <BR>>>> <BR>>>> <BR>>>>
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