From DLeistikow at webtv.net Wed Jun 1 00:03:06 2011 From: DLeistikow at webtv.net (Don L. Leistikow) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 23:03:06 -0500 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand In-Reply-To: Gary Schnabl 's message of Tue, 31 May 2011 22:05:31 -0400 Message-ID: <226-4DE5B9FA-3455@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: not available Url: http://mailman.dementix.org/pipermail/milwaukee-electric/attachments/20110531/51dde3cf/attachment.pl From rso1000 at hotmail.com Wed Jun 1 00:07:50 2011 From: rso1000 at hotmail.com (Ron Smolen) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 23:07:50 -0500 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand In-Reply-To: <226-4DE5B9FA-3455@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> References: Gary Schnabl 's message of Tue, 31 May Message-ID: Leon's mmmmmmm road trip time ! > From: DLeistikow at webtv.net > Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 23:03:06 -0500 > To: milwaukee-electric at lists.dementia.org > CC: emory1522 at wi.rr.com > Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand > > Gary S and list: The oldest Custard Stand that I recall as a child... > was Clark's Custard on Bluemound Road at 60th Street. > This Clark family member was a brother of Emory T. Clark who founded > Clark's Super Gas. At its peak there were some 1700+ Gas Stations in > the Clark system, throughout the Midwest. > > Also... another early Custard Stand, was Leon's, on 27th street at > Oklahoma Avenue and ,,,, it's still there. > > The time frams of my observations was in the early 1930's. > > fwiw..... Don L. > > > > -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below -- > -- Type: Message/RFC822 > -- Size: 3k (3892 bytes) > -- URL : http://lists.dementia.org/files/milwaukee-electric/ecartYLBFox > > > From gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com Wed Jun 1 07:21:32 2011 From: gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com (Gary Schnabl) Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 07:21:32 -0400 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand In-Reply-To: <226-4DE5B9FA-3455@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> References: <226-4DE5B9FA-3455@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> Message-ID: <4DE620BC.4060201@SWDetroit.com> On 6/1/2011 12:03 AM, Don L. Leistikow wrote: > Gary S and list: The oldest Custard Stand that I recall as a child... > was Clark's Custard on Bluemound Road at 60th Street. > This Clark family member was a brother of Emory T. Clark who founded > Clark's Super Gas. At its peak there were some 1700+ Gas Stations in > the Clark system, throughout the Midwest. > > Also... another early Custard Stand, was Leon's, on 27th street at > Oklahoma Avenue and ,,,, it's still there. > > The time frams of my observations was in the early 1930's. > > fwiw..... Don L. Gilles (75th & Bluemound Road) claims to be the oldest one still in business, from 1938. Gary -- Gary Schnabl Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is... Technical Editor forum From DLeistikow at webtv.net Wed Jun 1 08:15:29 2011 From: DLeistikow at webtv.net (Don L. Leistikow) Date: Wed, 1 Jun 2011 07:15:29 -0500 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest Custard Stand In-Reply-To: Gary Schnabl 's message of Wed, 01 Jun 2011 07:21:32 -0400 Message-ID: <228-4DE62D61-1481@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> Gary S and list; 'Gillies'... was an early Custard Stand but, as I recall, not quite as early as Clark's on Bluemound Road. Paul Gilles opened a bit later than Clark's. Where the 'Gillies' name came from, I do not know. I have thought that 'Gillies' was simply a moniiker or abstraction used by later, young patrons. A check of Wauwatosa Building Permits, could settle that question. Growing up in the 68th and Bluemound area in the 1930's, my memories lean toward Clark's, as the first Custard Stand. I think that Leon's and Gilles, opened a bit later. Did a lot of local travel on TMER&L's Route 10, Wells~Downer 500 Class Streetcars, back then. Caught onto the Local Rapid Transit Line about 1940 and then used that service, almost exclusively. Don L. From gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com Wed Jun 1 10:12:57 2011 From: gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com (Gary Schnabl) Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 10:12:57 -0400 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest Custard Stand In-Reply-To: <228-4DE62D61-1481@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> References: <228-4DE62D61-1481@storefull-3172.bay.webtv.net> Message-ID: <4DE648E9.7000809@SWDetroit.com> On 6/1/2011 8:15 AM, Don L. Leistikow wrote: > Gary S and list; 'Gillies'... was an early Custard Stand but, as I > recall, not quite as early as Clark's on Bluemound Road. > > Paul Gilles opened a bit later than Clark's. Where the 'Gillies' name > came from, I do not know. I have thought that 'Gillies' was simply a > moniiker or abstraction used by later, young patrons. > > A check of Wauwatosa Building Permits, could settle that question. > Growing up in the 68th and Bluemound area in the 1930's, my memories > lean toward Clark's, as the first Custard Stand. I think that Leon's > and Gilles, opened a bit later. > > Did a lot of local travel on TMER&L's Route 10, Wells~Downer 500 Class > Streetcars, back then. Caught onto the Local Rapid Transit Line about > 1940 and then used that service, almost exclusively. > > Don L. I suppose that Clark's was also in Wauwatosa, but I do not know where its boundary with Milwaukee is along Bluemound Rd. Of course, much of the then town of Wauwatosa was unincorporated at the turn of the 20th Century, as West Milwaukee (north of Greenfield before WM expanded south of Greenfield) was carved out of it, along with my grandparents' 30 acres at 42nd and Capitol before 1910 (the 1910 Census lists their house/"farm" location as being in Wauwatosa then). Wauwatosa (town) went as far north as Hampton and as far east as 27th Street (including the original real estate of the AO Smith Co., for example). One would think that the older inner city would have some custard stands, though, as the amount of space for a stand was minimal. 27th Street had some on both North and South sides ("sites", if speaking it "sout" of the river...) of town. Gary -- Gary Schnabl Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is... Technical Editor forum From DLeistikow at webtv.net Wed Jun 1 12:01:11 2011 From: DLeistikow at webtv.net (Don L. Leistikow) Date: Wed, 1 Jun 2011 11:01:11 -0500 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest Custard Stand In-Reply-To: Gary Schnabl 's message of Wed, 01 Jun 2011 10:12:57 -0400 Message-ID: <24739-4DE66247-2904@storefull-3173.bay.webtv.net> Gary S and list: The boundaries of the City of Wauwatosa, are a really unusual configuration. Suburbs are printed in various colors on my copy of a 1939 TMER&T Map. The eastern bundary in is mostly a straight line except for a bulge to the east for a few blocks, up to Hawley Road Then, Bluemound Road is the south line except for a protrusion south to about 40' north of Mount Vernon. Thes protrusion runs west to 71st street then, refuining to Bluemound Road. Another such segment, appears west of 84th street, south to the Rapid Transit Liner then west to 89thstreet where ithe booundary extends north to the Miwaukee County Institution Grounds. Similiar ragged Wauwatosa City limits exist on the western and northern borders. When TMER&L purchased land for the RTL between 100th and Lapham and its end of the private right of way between 7th and 8th off Clybourn streets, the property west of the Menomonee Valley, was known as the Town of Wauwatosa. The corridor between Wauwatosa and West Allis, became City of Milwaukee property. Therefore, I believe that the Town of Wauwatosa, was larger than what became the City of Wauwatosa. An oddity was that although I coudl see Juneau High School five blocks from my house, I went to Wauwatosa High School. Don L. From gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com Wed Jun 1 14:33:25 2011 From: gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com (Gary Schnabl) Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 14:33:25 -0400 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest Custard Stand In-Reply-To: <24739-4DE66247-2904@storefull-3173.bay.webtv.net> References: <24739-4DE66247-2904@storefull-3173.bay.webtv.net> Message-ID: <4DE685F5.2020409@SWDetroit.com> On 6/1/2011 12:01 PM, Don L. Leistikow wrote: > Gary S and list: The boundaries of the City of Wauwatosa, are a really > unusual configuration. Suburbs are printed in various colors on my copy > of a 1939 TMER&T Map. > > The eastern bundary in is mostly a straight line except for a bulge to > the east for a few blocks, up to Hawley Road Then, Bluemound Road is > the south line except for a protrusion south to about 40' north of > Mount Vernon. Thes protrusion runs west to 71st street then, refuining > to Bluemound Road. Another such segment, appears west of 84th street, > south to the Rapid Transit Liner then west to 89thstreet where ithe > booundary extends north to the Miwaukee County Institution Grounds. > > Similiar ragged Wauwatosa City limits exist on the western and northern > borders. > > When TMER&L purchased land for the RTL between 100th and Lapham and its > end of the private right of way between 7th and 8th off Clybourn > streets, the property west of the Menomonee Valley, was known as the > Town of Wauwatosa. > > The corridor between Wauwatosa and West Allis, became City of Milwaukee > property. Therefore, I believe that the Town of Wauwatosa, was larger > than what became the City of Wauwatosa. > > An oddity was that although I coudl see Juneau High School five blocks > from my house, I went to Wauwatosa High School. > > Don L. When I lived in Wisconsin, I was a certified building inspector and also a level-4 tax assessor. So, I know a bit about surveyed governing bodies in Wisconsin--towns, villages, and cities. Counties are something different. A town is generally the unincorporated region of a township (36 square miles, a 6-mile square). So, at various times, there could be the town of Milwaukee, the town of Wauwatosa, etc. The original town of Wauwatosa was bounded by 27th Street, Greenfield Avenue, Hampton, and whatever is six miles west of 27th Street. At sixteen E/W blocks per one Milwaukee mile, the western boundary would be roughly 96 blocks west of 27th. But, its western boundary is the county line--124th Street, 97 blocks west. So, maybe 28th Street might once have been the eastern boundary. At various times, parts of West Milwaukee (still a village today), West Allis, Wauwatosa (city), and Milwaukee were carved out of the town of Wauwatosa. Earlier, up to its annexation by Milwaukee in 1897, the southern part of the community of North Milwaukee was also carved out of Wauwatosa. As North Milwaukee went north of Hampton, it was also carved out of yet another town, probably Granville or some such. As far as railroads are concerned, both the NW and NE corners of the old town of Wauwatosa are railroad yards--Butler (formerly CNW--now UP) and whatever the yard (originally Milwaukee Road) it is called that the old 30th Street Industrial Corridor goes through. And West Milwaukee was once a big railroad community whose numerous residents there worked at the Milwaukee Road yards in the valley. Gary -- Gary Schnabl Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is... Technical Editor forum From yance at oldmilwaukee.net Wed Jun 1 12:42:41 2011 From: yance at oldmilwaukee.net (Y Marti) Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 12:42:41 -0400 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand In-Reply-To: <4DE59E6B.8080101@SWDetroit.com> References: <4DE59E6B.8080101@SWDetroit.com> Message-ID: <20110601124241.48854ycjiv65mzwo@horde.oldmilwaukee.net> Ice Cream Parlors have been in the city since at least the mid 1860s. Later drug stores commonly had soda and ice cream fountains which were always popular. Frozen custard has been available since the 1880s and probably was found at these ice cream parlors. I don't think Clark's or even Gilles ever sold only frozen custard although it has been a specialty of their drive-in restaurants. Clark's was actually more of a restaurant that served everything and back in the 30s was located at Capitol & Teutonia. Even Gilles is more known as a drive-in restaurant than solely a custard stand. More small shops and drive-ins started to sell frozen custard by the late 1930s and 1940s as specialty machines became more readily available. The first manufacturer of ice cream was Mansfield Ice Cream company which was established in 1907. Before they made it in a large scale facility it was made in small quantities directly in the parlors. Yance Quoting Gary Schnabl : > I tried to do a web search to see if there might be some useful > information about Milwaukee's oldest custard stand. Came up with nothing > much. > From my recollections of the 1940s and 1950s, those mom-and-pop stands > were sited about every mile or closer. For me, one in the 2700 block of > Capitol was 15 blocks from home, but one in the 4300 block was only a > block away. So, my parents would go there or have me walk over and get > some deep-fried fish, fries, ribs, chicken, phosphates, and stuff--even > custard--on Fridays, etc. > > The Wikipedia mentions that a custard stand on Coney Island was the > first such custard stand in 1919. Seeing that frozen custard was so > plentiful in my youth, there must have been a stand predating 1919 in > Milwaukee. > > > Gary > -- > > Gary Schnabl > Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is... > > Technical Editor forum > > > > > From gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com Thu Jun 2 01:27:05 2011 From: gSchnabl at SWDetroit.com (Gary Schnabl) Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2011 01:27:05 -0400 Subject: [milwaukee-electric] Re: Oldest custard stand In-Reply-To: <20110601124241.48854ycjiv65mzwo@horde.oldmilwaukee.net> References: <4DE59E6B.8080101@SWDetroit.com> <20110601124241.48854ycjiv65mzwo@horde.oldmilwaukee.net> Message-ID: <4DE71F29.70904@SWDetroit.com> On 6/1/2011 12:42 PM, Y Marti wrote: > Ice Cream Parlors have been in the city since at least the mid 1860s. > Later drug stores commonly had soda and ice cream fountains which were > always popular. Frozen custard has been available since the 1880s and > probably was found at these ice cream parlors. > > I don't think Clark's or even Gilles ever sold only frozen custard > although it has been a specialty of their drive-in restaurants. > Clark's was actually more of a restaurant that served everything and > back in the 30s was located at Capitol& Teutonia. Even Gilles is more > known as a drive-in restaurant than solely a custard stand. More small > shops and drive-ins started to sell frozen custard by the late 1930s > and 1940s as specialty machines became more readily available. > > The first manufacturer of ice cream was Mansfield Ice Cream company > which was established in 1907. Before they made it in a large scale > facility it was made in small quantities directly in the parlors. > > Yance I figured as much. There was a Rexall pharmacy at 42nd & Capitol (Carl's) that had an ice-cream/soda fountain until around 1952 or so, when its restaurant section was removed. Much homemade ice cream recipes are really frozen custard, too, according to the 1.4% or more egg-yolk composition in addition to the minimum 10% milkfat composition (ice-cream definition). The two custard stands on Capitol in my neighborhood referred to themselves as being frozen custard operations and were 12-month restaurants in contrast to Gilles, which was open only in warmer weather, around six months a year. So, my original question again is: When did the term "frozen custard" start being used for such stands or inside soda fountains or restaurants in Milwaukee? Did the Gehl's dairy on Capitol next to the freight yard make frozen custard? They supplied butter and milk (and, often, ice-cream) for my parochial school--St John de Nepomuc--a few blocks away daily. Gary -- Gary Schnabl Southwest Detroit, two miles NORTH! of Canada--Windsor, that is... Technical Editor forum