Speed

[Vigrass, Bill]

More how PAT LRT came to be what it is. When the transition was made from
SkyBus to LRT, there was a public input process, or at least input from
local communities. I had heard from sources now forgotten that each
community had its input in the public process.  Beechview wanted it in the
street, so they got it.  Mt. Lebanon wanted it off the street, so they got a
tunnel, with no stations yet.  I guess they didn't want it at all.  
And there may have been some other issues too that you noted.
And of course, the 47 Overbrook-Shannon-Library line had not been part of
SkyBus so was not funded under the transfer process.  Only now is it being
addressed.  'Bout time.   Bill V.

> ----------
> From: 	John Swindler[SMTP:j_swindler at hotmail.com]
> Reply To: 	pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Sent: 	Wednesday, October 20, 1999 12:56 PM
> To: 	pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Subject: 	Re: Speed
> 
> This has been an interesting discussion concerning the speed - or lack 
> thereof - of the 42S and 42L cars through Beechview.  Particularly when 
> compared with other cities, the "swiftness" of PAT's light rail operation
> is 
> not impressive.
> 
> For what its' worth, much of what exists in the South Hills today is a 
> legacy of the Skybus controversy some 25-30 years ago.
> 
> q.  Why does the light rail line follow the alignment through 
> Beechview-Castle Shannon-South Hills Village?
> a.  That's the Skybus alignment.
> 
> q.  Why is there a Mt. Lebanon tunnel?
> a.  In large measure, probably because Skybus called for a Mt. Lebanon 
> tunnel.  (and it makes sense)
> 
> q.  Why is there no Beechview tunnel, and thus slow operation on Broadway?
> a.  Besides being frightfully expensive, I suspect that, since Skybus
> called 
> for an elevated structure on the hillside west of Broadway, surface 
> operation on Broadway was a way to keep estimated light rail project costs
> 
> close to the Skybus projected costs.  (Just a guess - need to ask someone 
> involved in the decision process. Incidentally, Skybus would have
> continued 
> north from Broadway in subway towards the Wabash tunnel, then turn right
> at 
> the north end of the Wabash tunnel to follow the PRR towards the Panhandle
> 
> bridge)
> 
> q.  Why was the Penn Station spur built in the Golden Triangle?
> a.  That's the Skybus city terminal.
> 
> The discussion about Broadway operation in Beechview leads to speculation 
> about the following:
> 
> - So what exactly is a "light rail" line???
> 
> - And how is it different from a "streetcar" line???  Or a "tram" or 
> "trolley" line???
> 
> - Is it the vehicle or the right-of-way - or both that define a light rail
> 
> line???  Or something else???
> 
> - Have you considered that the Duewag U-2 car is not a light rail vehicle?
> 
> It's a "Stadtbahn" (or city railway) car from Frankfurt, (W.) Germany.
> (And 
> therein might lie some of the problems with Broadway.)
> 
> There's a story that Ed Tennyson (Deputy Sec. at PennDOT during 1970s)
> likes 
> to tell.  Gov. Shapp once asked him "what is this 'light rail' thing?"  Ed
> 
> asked the governor if he had ever used the Shaker Heights line when he
> went 
> to college in Cleveland?  When Gov. Shapp said "Yes, and it was good 
> transportation", Ed replied, "well, that's what light rail is!"
> 
> And maybe that's what the 42S line through Beechview - isn't.  It's still
> a 
> streetcar line (operating in mixed traffic), and will always be one.  It's
> 
> just not worth the cost to upgrade to eliminate mixed traffic.  And it
> would 
> also be less accessible to local residents.  Instead, perhaps Pittsburgh
> has 
> always had a light rail alignment through Overbrook.  And what PAT does
> with 
> it remains to be seen.
> 
> Just some random thoughts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >From: Jim Holland <pghpcc at pacbell.net>
> >Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >Subject: Re: Speed
> >Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 22:57:56 -0700
> 
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