[PRCo] Re: West Penn Zone Fare System

[Fred Schneider]

A very good question which I am unable to answer.  Had you asked it about Pittsburgh
Railways, I could have answered it.  I'll try in a general way.
Pittsburgh Railways had Ohmer receipt printers on the 1600s and 1700s.  Ohmer was the
man's name who founded the Philadelphia company.  The printers looked much like an old
store cash register on a post ... the operator pulled levers down to show that you got
on in zone 3 and paid to zone 7, cash or ticket, then pushed the button on the
machine.  It printed a receipt showing the origin and destination zones, the date, the
fare (or ticket if the operator received a ticket instead of cash), and also recorded
all vital information on another register tape that went to the dispatcher's office to
balance the turn in.

Ralph Chillcott had one of those receipt printers with a Allegheny Valley dye in it,
which suggests to me that they might or might not have been used on the valley route.

In lieu of that, a lot of companies simply used zone receipts ... I would suspect that
the most common form had all the zones printed on it allowing the conductor to simply
punch the destination zone.  If the company had a limited number of zones, it was
possible to have a single receipt or two for the outer zones.  Of course, unless it
was a two fold form, there was no accounting to keep the conductor honest.

Another approach might be simply to change the collection pattern.  Example, in
Baltimore everyone boarding a car paid as they entered until they crossed the city /
county boundary, then it changed to pay leave.  Therefore anyone who got off in
Baltimore County paid when the got off, any one getting on in the city paid one fare
to get on and another to get off.

Here in Lancaster, most suburban riders came from or to Lancaster city.  They used a
pay enter inbound, pay leave outbound system.  That covered most people.  The guy like
me who walked from downtown to the Pennsy station to save eight cents could easily be
remembered by the driver.

Some companies employed a second man who came through a car at each zone boundary and
collected another nickel.  I think it was called the "Conductors Full Employment
Act."  I think I read or heard that West Penn did that as long as they had two-man
cars.  That was the Philadelphia Rapid Transit / PTC approach even in the one-man
era.  If you were riding on 6 WILLOW GROVE beyond the city line, a floating conductor
would collect fares.  He would get on at City Line and Ogontz Avenue with a portable
fare box, go through the car and collect a zone fare from each outbound passenger, and
then get off and take the next car back.  I think he might have made a hand collect
again of everybody left on the car at City Line inbound.

No system is perfect; fares were lost.

Glad to hear you are still with us.

Titanium Fred

Fredbruhn at aol.com wrote:

> Gentlemen:
> There is much of the West Penn system that I am familiar with, a lot thanks
> to Ed and titanium Fred, but one area I am a complete dunce on is how  an
> operator was able to keep track of his fares.
>
> I am holding in front of me several WP tickets, and I'll describe them for
> both information and to be an introduction to my question.
>
> I will stick to the Coke Division because it will take an inspection tour of
> the AV Division before I know much about it:
>
> Grey ticket, marked WEST PENN RAILWAYS COMPANY across the top  then
> Good for a continusous Ride thru any NINE (9) ZONES with Subject to Tarriff
> Reguaations below.  Large     "9" down left side of ticket, and ticket number
> in Red
> boxed at lower left.
>
> Similiar ticket but printed This coupon good for a ONE ZONE FARE,  with small
> increasing numbers 1, 2, 3, 4 ..... in a small square lower left.  My strip
> is only 4 tickets.  The ticket number is red along right side  in vertical box.
>
> Older fancy white ticket with West Penn Railways in arch with System below
> and
> then in fancy letters WEST PENN"  in sort of like old English sytle over top.
>  Then
> "good for ride thru any one zone on all divisions.
>
> A couple of special tickets for information:
>
> 2 part purple ticket "Greensburg to Oakford Park" and "Oakford Park to
> Greensburg"
> on date of sale only.
>
> Three part red ticket:  McKeesport Terminal and Rainbow Gardens - Going and
> Rainbow Gardens and McKeesport Terminal  - Return plus third portion "This
> coupon
> good for one General Admission to Rainbow Gardens.   Back shows logo on top
> two portions plus R.G. and bottom says RAINBOW GARDENS.
>
> As above, but orange and to and from McKeesport (not McKeesport Terminal) and
> Olympia Park.  This ticket is not numbered as above 3 part set was.
>
> As I remember riding Canton City Lines buses (GM's) in the late 40's all I
> had to do was drop my token in the farebox and remember where to get off.
>
> So with all that, lets put a qualified operator (like Fred III) on the
> control of 739 at the Greensburg terminal and how does he keep his fares straight.
> Lets start with four passengers getting on at the terminal:  #1) is going to
> Latrobe,  #2) is going to Connellsville, #3) is getting off at  Youngwood  and
> #4) is a local fare.
>
> Do they all pick up their tickets from an agent in the terminal and when do
> they surrender  them to the operator.  Obviously  the operator or agent knows
> the number of zones to each of these destinations and can sell the correct
> number of zone tickets.
>
> Now, several blocks from the terminal, Aunt Lizzy boards from the street and
> wants to go to Uniontown.  How does operator Fred handle this?  At the end of
> street running in Greensburg two ladies board to go shopping in Scottdale.
> How does Fred keep track of these ladies.
>
> And so on.  If anyone can clarify this I'd appreciate it.  Even on the Shaker
> Rapid it was pretty easy, pay exit West bound and pay Enter Eastbound.  I
> figured  that one out and was not afraid to ask the operator when it was Shaker
> owned, but with the new breed of operators on RTA I don't think I'd ask.
>
> the other Fred