[PRCo] Re: Jones Cars

[Holland Electric Rwy. Op. H.E.R.O. -- Import SPTC 1.48 Models // James B. Holland]

Fred Schneider wrote:
.

> The midwest system --- if we can call it midwest -- Steubenville, East 
> Liverpool and Beaver Valley Traction Company.

.
What I referred to is some place in Kansas or Some Such Place.       I 
found an obscure reference to this  --  with photo  --  many decades ago 
but don't know where offhand, Fred!       Then, within last couple 
decades, I stumbled across another photo  --  *-may-*  have purchased 
same off web  --  father of seller took the photo of the car  --  never 
followed up on it after purchase and don't know where I stored that 
photo!       May have letter in files somewhere but will be difficult to 
find.


> I don't think the C trailers in Pittsburgh had K-63 control or at 
> least it was not wired completely as a K-63 would have been with 
> series-parallel.

.
My notes are crude  --  I am sure your references are more 
detailed.        You wrote a document briefly describing each  Group  
of  trolleycars owned by PRCo  (Groups determined After The Fact for 
organizational purposes)  and posted it to the dementia website  --  if 
it is still there, Jerry could read and download same for his information!


> No, the 4250s matched the 4300s and 4350s. Only the 4200s had a truly 
> unique body. 

.
Thank You for this clarification!       Something Very Appealing about 
the design and appearance of the 4200s  --  Not A Few of these were 
still around in 1950 and 4207 Or 4208 was often in Donora in the very 
late 1940s, early 1950s!

> But they all had Jones three-speed control. The three-speed comes from 
> three running points, i.e. three points with all motors running on no 
> resistance. In reality, Jones control used resistance only on the 
> first point and beyond that they used a myriad of weird motor 
> connections to increase speed. Examples of weird being two motors on 
> series, one on 550 volts, one dead. But the three running points would 
> have been all motors on series (550 volts divided by 4 would give 138 
> volts per motor), 2 series pairs of motors connected in parallel (275 
> volts per motor), and all motors in parallel (550 volts per motor). 
> They were probably hard on motors and slippery.

.
Traction Heritage published this from copies from the Traction Pubs of 
the day With Diagrams  -- think Kenneth Springirth included same in his 
book on PRCo.       Very Cheap, it worked, but probably Quite Hard on 
Motors and rather Jerky as well!

> The four converted trailers, 4700s, 4200s, 4300s, 6000s, 3700s, and 
> 2100s had Jones to start with. Many cars were scrapped with Jones 
> control in place. Those cars that lasted long enough, i.e. some 4300s, 
> 4350s, the 4700s and all the 3700s had it replaced with something much 
> more conventional.
>
> The 4420 series converted trailers were single-end cars, originally 
> with only a center door and later with a single front door added.

.
You sent me some spare copies of photos of some of these cars - Hi Floor 
with low floor trailer and one of the original trailers converted to 
full motor car before front door  --  would you object to me scanning 
same for the group?



> Holland Electric Rwy. Op. H.E.R.O. --  Import SPTC 1.48 Models // 
> James B. Holland wrote:
>
>> There is a place in the midwest that had a few of the Jones cars --  
>> can't remember off hand -- have a photo somewhere but even that 
>> eludes me at the moment. It was by accident that I came across this fact.
>>
>> Beaver Traction used the cars and their numbers were 400--411 --  
>> believe Beaver purchased them New but they could have come through 
>> PRCo,; can't remember now -- these cars came to Pittsburgh as 
>> 4400--4411 when Beaver didn't need them any more. ALL were gone by 
>> the very early 1940s (although my notes for scrapping of 4400--4405 
>> are unreadable -- maybe Ed has something more definitive.)
>


Jim__Holland


I__Like__Ike.......And__PCCs!!

down with pantographs ---- UP___WITH___TROLLEYPOLES!!!!!!!