[PRCo] Re: PTM and 4398

[Edward H. Lybarger]

M1 cost $250, I believe.  West Penn 832 was $500.  They wanted $1000 for a
700-car.

A 3800?  Pricey.  Storage was an issue.  They were junk in the first place.
Better to have taken 3756 later...at least it was representative of the
entire system. 

-----Original Message-----
From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
[mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of Fred
Schneider
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 6:21 PM
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Subject: [PRCo] Re: PTM and 4398

Remember that the early PERC acquisitions were purchased, not by the  
club, but by members.   The club had no money.   That route was  
typical of most of the museums in the early days.  The going rate for a
trolley car in the late 1940s was about $200 to beat out the scrap  
dealer.   Something like a West Penn 700 was probably closer to  
$350.   Put that into today's dollars ... probably $3,000 to $5,000.   
That's not exactly pocket change for most people.   And then you have  
to pay what today would be another few grand to move it somewhere.    
A worn out PRC 3800 in 1952 might have been been in the $4000 to  
$5000 range in today's dollars.    M-1 was probably cheap because it  
had no cash value other than scrap steel in the wheels, trucks, motors,
controls and copper ... the entire frame and body was only wood and it would
be burnt ... probably 40% of its weight would be  
burnt ... I'll bet it went for close to $100 back then.   Now someone  
prove I'm wrong but I suspect I'm in the ball park.

We should consider it fortuitous that the guys were able to save M-1,
3756 and West Penn 832 out of their own pockets and to buy a few  
thousand feet of track and put up a pole barn.    Remember too that  
PRC 1138 is not exactly a critter that you find in every museum.    
There are dozens of Shaker all-electrics rusting away.   Boston PCCs  
are a dime a dozen.   SEPTA all-electrics are out there by the  
dozens.   Virtually all of the fleet that Red Arrow owned in the  
1980s had survived.   But the earliest PCC cars are rare ... one  
Pittsburgh car survived.   One Brooklyn car is at Branford.  There  
are two San Diego cars at Orange Empire, and one more at Baltimore which BSM
wants to back date to look like one of BTC's 28 1937 St.  
Louis PCCs.   OERM has a Los Angeles P class car from 1937.   That's  
it guys.   The 1138 is in good structural condition and we should be  
glad that someone saved in in 1960.

And how many really nice horse cars are there?   Both the museums in  
Washington PA and Baltimore have them.   The Baltimore one was  
rebuilt with rubber wheels to be used in parades and we are now in  
the process of rebuilding it back to steel wheels.   The Pittsburgh,  
Allegheny and Manchester car (PRC M3) was covered with tin to hide the
decaying wood and the platforms are sagging beyond belief but it looks nice.

On May 6, 2008, at 4:48 PM, Herb Brannon wrote:

> Since we are on the topic of "saved" PRCo cars.......
>   Why was a 3800 series interurban never saved?? They were around 
> until 1950. It seems someone would have tried to get one off the scrap 
> pile.
> Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net> wrote:
>   PST 14 and 78 were not operational. The other revenue fleet was 
> marked in service but not everything was run. Of course that excludes 
> 4398, and Pittsburgh 1100 series PCC and a whole lot of stuff in the 
> Blimp Hanger which is not in the revenue fleet.
>
> On May 6, 2008, at 9:33 AM, Jerry Matt Matsick wrote:
>
>> Mark M and myself wonder what "cars" actually were operational this 
>> past weekend? Both of us would have given anything to be there as it 
>> looked like a fantastic time.
>> --
>> From the River City by the Sea!
>> Jerry "Matt" Matsick
>> "Jacksonville"
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> Herb Brannon
>
>   Greetings From America's North Coast
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>