[PRCo] Neville Island

Sat Apr 25 18:30:43 EDT 2009

> ----- Original Message ----

> From: Herb Brannon <hrbran at cavtel.net>
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2009 1:18:50 PM
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: derail
> 
> I just passed it on. It's from the Pennsylvania Antiquie Motor Bus
> Group. Also, when it comes down to economic operation PRCo was content
> to run streetcars so long as some money could be made. They (PRCo)
> probably did not want to fight the competition on Neville Island and
> into Coraopolis. Neville Island running was slow and very unsafe given
> the location of the tracks and the fact that passengers were dropped
> off into a lane of fast moving autos. Single track (the main drawback
> to many PRCo routes) added extra minutes and increased accident
> exposure time. Running time with conventional cars was 58 minutes
> (+/-), however, running time with PCCs increased to 65 minutes (+/-).
> The bus was most likely faster. The relationship between PRCo and the
> PUC was not the best either. Given that climate PRCo management
> probably did not shed many tears when the Neville Island, Coraopolis,
> Sewickley service was cut back to Island Avenue.
> 
Mr.Brannon;

I never saw Neville Island operations;  the photo on pg.171 of PCC Coast to Coast
shows an huge expanse of highway and only 2-motor vehicles.  Prw is side of the road
so passenger concern was one direction only.  Operations should have been fast
on the Island;  slow in Coraopolis.  Old cars probably did at least tripper service
until and even including the cutback to 25-Island Avenue only as this was accomplished
in 1952.  I don't see PCCs being slower;  traffic in Coraopolis would have been the
main problem but could that account for an additional 7-min?

Phil

> On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell
> wrote:
> >
> > Mr.Brannon;
> >
> >
> > Thank you very much for taking the time to prepare this report;  it is very
> > revealing isn't it.  The competing service of SCL and PRC in Coraopolis
> > not unlike that on the 62 in Trafford - the bus line scheduled service just
> > ahead of the trolley.  PRC should have fought that on the basis of unfair
> > service.  Seems strange today that those antique buses could offer any
> > competition to a trolley but people like trying something new.
> >
> > Thanks again.
> >
> >
> > Phil
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> ----- Original Message ----
> >> From: Herb Brannon 
> >> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 4:31:34 PM
> >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: derail
> >>
> >> The following is from the Pennsylvania Antique Motor Bus Society:
> >>
> >>
> >> Shafer Coach Lines (SCL) can trace its roots back to May of 1928 when
> >> a small bus line was started by a Mr. Helsley to connect the
> >> Pittsburgh Railways Company (PRCo) streetcar line 23 in Coraopolis to
> >> Clinton which was 10 miles away. This two bus operation had its rights
> >> renewed for this feeder type service in 1930 but were not renewed
> >> after that so it is assumed that the service was abandoned between
> >> 1930 and 1932.
> >>
> >> The next attempt at a bus line in the Coraopolis area was made in 1937
> >> by William A. Shafer, an operator of a trucking line. Applications
> >> were filed for 4 routes, one of which was Mr. Helsley's old route.
> >> Three of the routes were granted quickly by the PSC and by August of
> >> 1937, operations commenced on the original route, a
> >> Coraopolis-Imperial feeder, and a line from Coraopolis to Aliquippa
> >> via Broadhead Road. The 4th route was held up as the application was
> >> considered competitive to the PRCo 23 streetcar route as well as the
> >> fact that the Ohio River Motor Coach Company also applied for a
> >> similar route at the same time.
> >>
> >> The SCL was ultimately awarded the rights to the line over Ohio River
> >> Motor Coach in the summer of 1938 and service was started on this line
> >> after 5 new Beaver Coaches were delivered in August of 1938. This 4th
> >> line was considered the backbone of the SCL operation and ran from
> >> Aliquippa to Pittsburgh via Neville Island, McKees Rocks and the West
> >> End (similar to the 21A Coraopolis to Aliquippa route of PAT today).
> >>
> >> An additional line was added in November of 1938 and went from McKees
> >> Rocks to Coraopolis and Sewickley via Kenmawr. The Coraopolis-Clinton
> >> line was also extended to Groveton at this time to provide extra
> >> service on a portion of the new line.
> >>
> >> The next major service changes for SCL occurred in 1943 when 2 of the
> >> feeder routes were cut back from their original termination points and
> >> a new route in October of 1943 was instituted from Coraopolis to the
> >> Mooncrest housing project.
> >>
> >> Although the PSC (later the PUC) tended to restrict local traffic on
> >> certain carriers if competition would result, the PRCo streetcar line
> >> 23 and SCL had no such restriction outside of the City of Pittsburgh.
> >> PRCo and SCL had what many would call a competition war, primarily in
> >> the Coraopolis area. SCL had similar headways and fares during the
> >> 1940's and 50's as the PRCo 23 line did. Based on events that
> >> occurred, it appeared that SCL had its buses scheduled just ahead of
> >> the PRCo streetcars and to counter the loss of ridership, PRCo
> >> increased service on the line. SCL filed a complaint with the PUC
> >> claiming that PRCo was engaging in unfair competition by increasing
> >> service on its line and the PUC upheld the complaint.
> >>
> >> The action by the PUC, as well as losing passengers, revenue and the
> >> fact that there was yet another application for a competitive bus
> >> service along its route (which was later denied by the PUC), made PRCo
> >> cut back the 23 line to Graham Loop on Neville Island and later to
> >> Fleming Park Loop in West Park. A short lived bus feeder was run from
> >> 1953 to August 15, 1955 by PRCo from Fleming Park Loop to Graham Loop
> >> after the second cutback but was abandoned due to declining ridership.
> >> After the PRCo feeder was abandoned, SCL had exclusive service on
> >> Neville Island as well as Coraopolis.
> >>
> >> No major changes in service occurred for SCL for almost 20 years
> >> except for adjustments to accommodate changing traffic patterns,
> >> primarily the opening of the Fort Pitt Bridge in 1959. The only other
> >> notable event was a deviation on the Pittsburgh-Coraopolis-Airport
> >> line to serve Sharon Hill Manor in Moon Township in 1963.
> >>
> >> It needs to be noted that the Airport service that SCL ran was heavily
> >> restricted as Airlines Transportation Company held rights to haul
> >> passengers to the Greater Pittsburgh Airport. SCL ran trips intended
> >> only for airline employees to get to and from work.
> >>
> >> SCL's equipment was in good shape and maintained exceptionally well.
> >> They were one of the few Pittsburgh independents that exclusively
> >> operated transit buses without center doors which some call muzzle
> >> loaders. At takeover the SCL turned over 29 buses and 5 routes to PAT.
> >>
> >> ________________________________
> >> Acquired Equipment (with PAT number if re-numbered)
> >> Shafer NumberMakeModelYearPAT Number
> >> 59BrillC-311951186
> >> 61-62BrillC-311951194,197
> >> 63-64BrillC-311951195,196
> >> 65BrillC-311951198
> >> 67BrillC-311951199
> >> 69-71BeaverB-35-PT1952686-688
> >> 72BeaverB-40-PT1953689
> >> 73-78GMTDH37141954760-765
> >> 79-80GMTDH45121955401-402
> >> 81-82GMTDH45121956403-404
> >> 83-84GMTDH45121957405-406
> >> 85-86GMTDH45171960571-572
> >> 87GMTDH45121955407
> >> 88-89GMTDH45121953408-409
> >> 90GMTDH45121955410
> >>
> >> Note: Coaches 88-90 were second hand.
> >>
> >> ________________________________
> >> Routes (shown with PAT numbers)
> >> 21A Coraopolis
> >> 21B Kenmawr
> >> 25A Sewickley - Groveton
> >> 25B Broadhead Road
> >> 38A Airport Express
> >>
> >> On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 3:58 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Mr.Barry;
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > You always come up with very interesting photos don't you.
> >> >
> >> > It will take some time to study this photo;  only the one overhead wire 
> curves
> >> > onto the bridge.  The other wire could curve out of the picture to allow 
> for
> >> > overhang of car ends.  I have the collection of bus articles on Pittsburgh;
> >> > now I need to find them and see if 'Shafer' routes can be identified.  Can 
> we
> >> > deduce that trolleys are 4 times heavier than 'heavy' trucks?
> >> >
> >> > It is now very tricky to save huge files isn't it since one can't right 
> click.  It
> >> > is necessary to save parts and do a photo merge.  Must be an easier way.
> >> >
> >> > This is a favorite of mine:
> > http://tinyurl.com/1515on50SmithfieldWater
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Phil
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > > ----- Original Message ----
> >> > > From: "Barry, Matthew R"
> >> > > To: "pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org"
> >> > > Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 6:50:58 AM
> >> > > Subject: [PRCo] Re: derail
> >> > >
> >> > > I got the photo from the Historic Pittsburgh site.   There's a couple 
> more
> >> > > interesting ones on there, such as this one...   anyone know the bridge?
> >> > > Here is the link to the new set on Historic Pittsburgh:
> >> > >
> > 
> http://images.library.pitt.edu/cgi-bin/i/image/image-idx?c=ascgen&g=imls&page=index
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Matt
> >> > >
> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> > > From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
> >> > > [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of 
> Phillip
> >> > > Clark Campbell
> >> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 22, 2009 2:51 PM
> >> > > To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >> > > Subject: [PRCo] Re: derail
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Mr.Barry;
> >> > >
> >> > > Great photo isn't it; where did you find it?
> >> > >
> >> > >
http://lists.dementia.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/bridge_restriction.jpg