[PRCo] PRC book

Sun Aug 23 18:41:04 EDT 2009

Mr.Lybarger;

You have struck a cord;  I was thinking along this very line
and composing a mental email but now have a reason to reply.

First,  I have seen this book topic a multitude of times in the archives.
Mr.Schneider has addressed the work involved in his PCC books.
I have an academic understanding of the work involved;  that said,
such an understanding still "seriously underestimates" the actual
amount of work involved by 20 to 100 fold and more.  By way of
example, just consider the foldouts in the back of the PCC books
about PCCs 'world wide.'  Collecting that information before the
inet would be tedious and time consuming, but just look at the wealth
of information that is included.  This is just in the foldouts;  the books
continue with the wealth and depth of information.  Maybe we need
to add to your questions below:
Specifically name other trolley books that are this thorough and this
accurate and this high quality.  I hope there are more out there but
it would seem they are very few in number doesn't it.

It would seem that the 'promise' of several PRC books dampens
enthusiasm of others to produce same thus the delay in getting
'good' books to market.  Additionally, the market is thin;  production
costs are expensive and unfortunately the current economy may
kill any and all efforts in this regard.  (I hope I am wrong but I expect
the economy to get much worse;  what others say is the end to the
recession 'could' be just a breather before more problems present
themselves.  Historical precedent exists;  those who claim 'we know
too much to repeat mistakes of the past' are blind to the "Fact" that
the very same was said from the 1920s into the 1930s;  please
check here:)
http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_01/seymour062001.html

Weren't the low-floors developed as trailers for the High Floors?  Then
Mr.Jones coaxed WH to develop a motor for such small wheels.  Some
of the trailers were converted to motors and the low-floor era in Pgh. was
born.

#2 would be extreme competition but after formation of PRC the highly
unusual millenium leases of the underliers siphoned off profits.  Many
other items could 'contribute' but the amount of contribution may be
difficult to assess.  Pgh City seemed highly hostile to PRC and thus
obstructive.  Trolleys were disliked early on but it is amazing that the
same existed in Pgh. longer than elsewhere.

I don't have a clue as to the rest.

Time Period:
1930--1955 but please enclose info about the 3600s which were
scrapped by 1928.

	* Pittsburgh inherited a hodge-podge mixture of equipment for which research would be far far more than tedious.  This equipment was gone or totally phased out very early in this period.  While these cars are interesting the low-floor and PCCs are the corporate identity.  This helps to eliminate excessive work.

	* While PRC did order some new equipment very early on, the low-floor trailers also debuted early allowing low-floors to become the backbone of the system.  The St.Louis-38s and Brill Interurbans were a variation on this theme.
	* PRC identity, all equipment save the PCCs, and infrastructure were well established by this time.  PCCs delivered during this time frame.
	* During this time frame PRC was highly consistent in its operations which seemed to fall apart by 1960 forward.
	* There is a wealth of photos available on the inet from 1960 forward;  little is available before 1955 and certainly less before 1950.  Most of us have memories, photos, booklets, experience of the 1950s forward;  I want to 'see the unseen' to know the 'glory days' if such a term may be used.  It was downhill at considerable speed in the mid-1950s with the spread of suburbia.
	* I don't understand the objection to the 'same paint livery;'  that is the way it was.  Up close roster shots are needed for car detail but 'Ed Miller' style photos of trolleys in their environs mutes the color objection, which is certainly not an objection personally.  Car Barn shots are tedious;  Dave's photos on the inet emphasizes that point.  Professional designers were apparently used when the cars were built allowing for good aesthetics.  As paint was simplified and design features compromised, the character of the cars changed for the worse in most cases.  This accelerated markedly in the very late 1950s.
	* Roster photos don't need to come from the builder;  the enclosed photo of 3709 could be used for such.  It is dynamic, has real visual impact, is in service, location easily identified, not quite an Ed Miller style photo but trending that direction while still 'roster-quality;'  action packed.  (My apologies but I do not know the source of this photo.)

History:

Apparently hundreds of underliers were incorporated into PRC;  reading such
is not unlike 'Abraham begat Joseph and Joseph begat...'  Good Grief, that
gets old doesn't it.  How much stock was issued for how many $$ and so on
is of little interest.  Regardless of articles of incorporation, politics, love / hate
relationships, fire, famine, flood, and bankruptcies,  PRC existed.  I am
interested in this 'existence.'

The following interests me without specific order:

	* Equipment assignments - re-assignments

	* Routes
	* Track diagrams like the museum map.
	* Infrastructure
	* Schedules - frequencies - owl routes.
	* Safety decisions - derails, construction of trestles, equipment considerations.
	* Special operations like County Fair;  I have gleaned some information from the archives.  It amazes me that operators  from Homewood and other remote PRC areas or lines would take cars on the Interurban to W.Library and back because operational characteristics are so different, or did operators change out at South Hills?
	* Where external policies like below significantly affect operations, this could be mentioned to add impact.Even more specifically I am interested in the PRC Interurban system
which could be a book unto itself.  South Hills lines follow that, then the
West End because of its elusiveness and early demise relative to PRC.
Regardless, the WE certainly lasted longer than trolleys in other cities.
The East End because of its size and variety comes next followed
by the North side.

Other items could be included but it would seem that this covers
most basics.  It would seem a decade of work would be needed to
complete such a project; at 76 I doubt I shall see the results.

Phil
Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'

PS - Mr.Lybarger;  I forwarded your roster comments to Mr.Holland,
actually  blind-cc.  I am also blind copying this to a number of people
who may be interested in a PRC book.

________________________________
From: Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 2:18:21 PM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: PRCo Volumn 2

And since John, together with Fred, are the only two on the list
that I know have authored books and know what's involved,
I would next ask:  In what era?

As for all the facts not being in, I will discuss a couple examples of
things I have learned in the last year or so.  But I'll put them as exam
questions, to see if it was just me who was behind the times!

1.  What was the real history behind the development of the low-floor car
(Fred is disqualified to comment on this question, since he and I had a
discussion on the matter last Friday!)?

2.  Why did the corporate entities comprising the streetcar company serving
Pittsburgh never have a chance of being financial successes?

3.  What was the 49-Year Agreement with the City of Pittsburgh?  Did it
affect the railway company's future well-being?

4.  Why was the Traction Conference Board essential to the reorganization of
the railway company?

5.  Why couldn't Pittsburgh Railways change a routing whenever it wanted to?

> From: Ed Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
> Reply-To: Pittsburgh Railways Group <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 12:13:34 -0400
> To: Pittsburgh Railways Group <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: PRCo Volumn 2
> 
> "Nothing is impossible to the person who doesn't have to do the work."
> 
> Are we wanting a history or a railfan book?

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