[PRCo] Re: Dallas

Sun Sep 27 18:40:00 EDT 2009

Do you think that might have something to do with it John?

On Sep 27, 2009, at 2:32 PM, John Swindler wrote:

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> Is that why PATCO has announced an overhaul of the original cars  
> for continued service?
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> Likewise Milan is overhauling their remaining Peter Witt cars for  
> continued service.
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> And there are no plans in place to replace the Kawasaki LRVs nor  
> Broad St. cars in Philadelphia.  Cars are still getting routine 5-7  
> year general overhauls.
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> And it was almost ten years ago that the Siemens built light rail  
> cars became the oldest vehicles in the PAT fleet.
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>> From: fwschneider at comcast.net
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Dallas
>> Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 20:00:47 -0400
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
>>
>> I do not remember who built the original Dallas cars. The low-floor
>> center sections are new. They go with the on-going conversion to
>> low-level platforms throughout the entire DARTsystem.
>>
>> If I am not making myself totally clear ... they are adding the
>> center section, lengthening the trains, and then removing the
>> handicapped lifts or high level facilities at the stations because
>> now everyone will be able to get on the cars at the middle of the  
>> train.
>>
>> I am on DART's e-mail news release list. I've seen the
>> announcements. But if you were to ask me when will the conversion
>> be 100% completed, I don't know.
>>
>> This approach is not uncommon. I first saw the Europeans doing the
>> same thing ... I think it was in Tallin, Estonia that I first saw  
>> low-
>> floor center sections being added to cars.
>>
>> Unfortunately, this approach never has lasted long because the end
>> sections of the cars are already old when you do it. The original
>> single truck cars that Boston converted to two-bedroom and bath cars
>> to make them more labor efficient around the turn on the century
>> didn't buy many more years because they were junk to start with.
>> Pittsburgh's splice cars 2100 and 2101 didn't last long either
>> because they built them out of worn out wooden bodies. DART is
>> apparently attempting to prolong the life of 40 cars built in 1996
>> and 75 more built in 2001-2002.
>>
>> To put their age into perspective ... the first cars now are 13 years
>> old. That is older than the original 25 Dallas PCC cars were when
>> streetcars were abandoned in Dallas in 1956. That's about one year
>> less than Vancouver got out of its PCCs. Its the longevity of the
>> 600 PCCs that Chicago bought after World War II. We are now at
>> 65% of the life of the Brooklyn PCCs or the Pittsburgh 1000s or  
>> 1100s.
>>
>> Granted there are exceptions but in an environment where the federal
>> government pays you to throw away equipment and buy new vehicles, I
>> would not count on those rebuilds being around for two long.
>>
>> If you want the details, here is the fact sheet that DART released.
>>
>> http://www.dart.org/factsheet/slrv/default.asp
>>
>> On Sep 26, 2009, at 5:59 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:
>>
>>> I don't always understand computers; this was sent
>>> 'successfully' early in the AM yet does not appear in my
>>> inbox nor sent folders, just the draft. This is a retry; my
>>> apologies if this is a second copy.
>>>
>>>
>>>> From: Schneider Fred <fwschneider at comcast.net>
>>>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
>>>> Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2009 6:39:22 AM
>>>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Dallas .... first service to Fair Park ...
>>>> enlarge one of those jpeg or tiff photos ... they're great.
>>>
>>>> I do not know what your point is Phil.
>>>
>>>> If it is the high level loading in Dallas, forget it.
>>>> DART is converting the entire system to
>>>> low floor loading.
>>>
>>> ...so says Mr.Schneider. What do the references
>>> from the website say in the form of these Urls?
>>>
>>> It appears that the bulk of the car is standard floor.
>>> It appears that the car is double articulated.
>>> It also appears that only the very center section
>>> of the car is low floor.
>>> It appears that the bulk of the car - each end before
>>> the articulation - is standard floor.
>>> Thus the system is not low-floor but 25%-low-floor.
>>> 2-3-steps very much in evidence.
>>> Doors appear to slide into a well.
>>>
>>> Who manufactures these cars?
>>>
>>> I like this configuration.
>>>
>>> http://www.dart.org/images/newsroom/preview/fairparkevening.jpg
>>>
>>> http://www.dart.org/images/newsroom/greenlineart/preview/
>>> supersaturdayboarding.jpg
>>>
>>> http://www.dart.org/newsroom/greenlinemediakit/images/preview/
>>> PorcariDARTTour.jpg
>>>
>>> http://www.dart.org/newsroom/greenlinemediakit/images/preview/
>>> lrtnorthdeepellum.jpg
>>>
>>> On the other hand Portland is listed as a 70% low-floor
>>> car, double articulated. Only the very end of the car over
>>> the power truck is standard floor; all the rest of the car is
>>> low-floor which including the center section between the
>>> articulated joints and beyond the articulation to the
>>> power truck.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Phil
>>> Without a 'coast' but not a 'cause.'
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>>>> From: Schneider Fred <fwschneider at comcast.net>
>>>>> To: Skip Gatermann <biker4 at sbcglobal.net>
>>>>> Cc: Mike Schreiber <m11h16s45 at aol.com>; Michael Greene
>>>>> <michael_t_greene at yahoo.com>; Matt Dawn <mwntrolley at aol.com>;
>>>>> Conrad Misek <crmisek at aol.com>; Joe Bux <baybridgecondo3 at aol.com>;
>>>>> Frank Pfuhler <PFUHLER at MSN.COM>; E Casey <ecasey9631 at aol.com>; Vic
>>>>> Gordon <lipizzansvt2 at aol.com>; David Dillard <jwne at temple.edu>;
>>>>> John Sikorskie <sparkyberadi at aol.com>; Jim Greller
>>>>> <jcgreller at hcia.org>; Randy Gluckman <randygluck1 at aol.com>; Bob
>>>>> Vogel <chuchubob at yahoo.com>; Bradley Clark <bhc1 at aol.com>; Mary
>>>>> O'Brien <maryobrien at charter.net>; Jimmy Boylan XX
>>>>> <jamesboylan at compuserve.com>; Bill Armstrong <wja1933 at juno.com>;
>>>>> Richard Panse <brtpcc at mac.com>; Alex Vaughn
>>>>> <alexlvaughn at yahoo.com>; Brad Noyes <nozze4 at att.net>; Bill
>>>>> Mangahas <newkirk at optonline.net>; JJ Earl <dukeoq at aol.com>; Joseph
>>>>> Frank <nycmodeltransit at webtv.net>; Jack Rush XX <rush123 at cox.net>;
>>>>> Mark Goldfeder <frgs4evr at aol.com>; Andrew Chalfen
>>>>> <chalfen at pobox.upenn.edu>; Michael Rambo Jr <mrambojr at yahoo.com>;
>>>>> Ted
>>>> Eickmann <twe2431 at sbcglobal.net>; Bill Paulus
>>>> <studedude43 at hotmail.com>; Muench <cemuench2 at comcast.net>; Bruce
>>>> Bente <bbente at bellsouth.net>; Raleigh Dadamo <dadamor at aol.com>;
>>>> David Horwitz <air2619 at aol.com>; David Pirmann
>>>> <pirmann at quuxuum.org>; Neil Carlson <ndc10169 at webtv.net>; Chris
>>>> Gatermann <cgatermann at yahoo.com>; Robert Arce <r516169 at yahoo.com>;
>>>> KELVIN WILKE <kwilke4 at sbcglobal.net>; Raymond Crapo Jr
>>>> <raycrapo at prodigy.net>; Carlos Mercado <cmercado at rochester.rr.com>;
>>>> Merill Resnick <mhr62 at aol.com>; Jack May <jack.may at americomm.net>;
>>>> Lewis Hitch <lewis.hitch at verizon.net>; Michael Richmond
>>>> <neosho_wildcat_graduate_2007 at yahoo.com>; Thurston Clark
>>>> <trolleydude1 at yahoo.com>; Edward Havens <edhavens at cox.net>; Jeff
>>>> Marinoff <jeffmarinoff at yahoo.com>; Harry Pinsker <hp1944 at aol.com>;
>>>>> Joseph Eid <jeidj at comcast.net>; Scott Becker <sbecker at pa-
>>>> trolley.org>; William Young <wbyoung at mindspring.com>; Russ Jackson
>>>>> <rejmhj at netzero.net>; C. K. Leverett
>>>>> <cleverett at comcast.net>; Charles Greene
>>>>> <charles.greene99 at gmail.com>; Ronald Kupin <ronkup at hotmail.com>;
>>>>> Nate Gerstein <atsnate at comcast.net>; Melvin Bernero
>>>>> <mbernero at prodigy.net>; Favorite Daugher <cue37 at charter.net>;
>>>>> George Boucher <berasltm18 at sbcglobal.net>; Rich Parente
>>>>> <urr316 at optonline.net>; Evan Jennings <evan at tmny.org>; Harold Golk
>>>>> <haroldgolk at comcast.net>; Matthew Mummert <mlmummert at comcast.net>;
>>>>> Bob Paradise <rjp500 at snet.net>; Bill Volkmer
>>>>> <bvolkmer at bellsouth.net>; Andrew Sisk <asisk at sbcglobal.net>;
>>>>> Charlie Dennis <cdennis220 at aol.com>; Herald Wind
>>>>> <hlwind384 at comcast.net>; Bill Myers <TrolleyBill77 at cs.com>; Tom
>>>>> Gatermann <tgatermann at gmail.com>; Edward Davis
>>>> <biged_IRT5543 at bresnan.net>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:10:57 PM
>>>>> Subject: [PRCo] Dallas .... first service to Fair Park ... enlarge
>>>>> one of those jpeg or tiff photos ... they're great.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.dart.org/newsroom/greenlinemediakit/default.asp#images
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sep 25, 2009, at 10:38 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.dart.org/riding/accessibility.asp#rail
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Phil
>>>> Without a 'coast' but not a 'cause.'
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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