[PRCo] Re: PCC Left turn Smithfield to 6th!

Sun Nov 14 13:53:16 EST 2010

Mr.Lybarger;

Interesting points, thank you.  While the university makes mistakes
the ones through this 'thread' of photos are very consistent;  these mistakes
are not evident in the rest of the photos.  Either one 'researcher' wrote
the text to these photos or they came from the photographer or supplier
of the photographs.

The location alone is so blatantly wrong it's impossible to understand
how such a mistake could be made, even innocently.

Phil
Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'

________________________________
From: Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Sent: Sun, November 14, 2010 10:05:52 AM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: PCC Left turn Smithfield to 6th!

I concur with Herb regarding Blaine's writing ability.
He asked both Fred and me some time back to review his forthcoming Pittsburgh 
manuscript, and I can assure everyone that you'll
want this book when it is published.

What I think happened on the photo mis-identifications is this:  Blaine's
youthful fantasy of being the "Pittsburgh Railways Company" probably
resulted in a rubber stamp being made, along with the letterheads.  In turn
the rubber stamp was likely used to indicate the source of the photos, which
I believe were given to Mr. Palmer, whose friendship Blaine had.  They ended
up in the PRC material that was ultimately deposited in Hillman Library, and
were incompletely identified.  The photo information was likely supplied by
university staff, who have a poor track record in interpreting things (and
don't seem to like to be told what the facts are).

Ed

-----Original Message-----
From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
[mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of Herb
Brannon
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2010 12:46 AM
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Subject: [PRCo] Re: PCC Left turn Smithfield to 6th!

Blaine Hays may have taken the photos. However, if you have read either
"Cleveland's Transit Vehicles", or "From Horse Trails To Regional Rails",
both well written, and correctly informative hard bound companion volumes
tracing the history of Cleveland public transportation, you would see this
is not the style of Blaine Hays. It appears someone else provided the
information. I'm going to refrain from "head shakes and chuckles" until I'm
sure of the source of the information.

On Sat, Nov 13, 2010 at 21:18, Phillip Clark Campbell
<pcc_sr at yahoo.com>wrote:

> Mr.Lybarger;
>
> But of course;  and your response is one of the rare ones from a 
> gentleman!  The errors are why I put an exclamation mark at the end of 
> the Subject line.  I noted this was from the Blaine Hays collection;  
> it seems 'possible' he provided the 'mis'information isn't it!  It is 
> worth a few head shakes and chuckles as well.
>
> I searched for  'Blaine S. Hays'  and came up with a page of Pgh.
> photos credited to him:  http://tinyurl.com/BlaineHayes
>
> Looking at the descriptions on his pictures 'suggests' my hunch about 
> him providing information is correct.  Note this one:
> http://tinyurl.com/1696-21-1966
>
> Isn't Mr.Hays reportedly working on a Prc book?  Isn't he in Cleveland?
> Some of the misinformation is understandable but calling a Trolley a 
> 'bus'  seems strange.  Comments about the Pat takeover seem to be in 
> many of his photos as well.
> http://tinyurl.com/1747-64-1966
>
> "The 1600 Series were fully developed air cars and  the last air cars 
> with no standee windows. Eleven of these cars were  outfitted as 
> interurbans to prove that PCCs could make the long run  comfortably 
> leading the way for the 1700 Interurbans."
> Of course they were 'air cars without standee windows!'
> http://tinyurl.com/1651-1967
>
> "Buses 1729 and 1560 crossing side-by-side."
> http://tinyurl.com/1729-1560
>
> The other misinformation is less glaring.  If Mr.Hays is working on a 
> Pgh. book,  I have lost interest.
>
> There is another photo where 3-different car numbers are listed-- one 
> on the car and two in the text (this one is not Mr.Hayes:)
> http://tinyurl.com/1605-1506-1606
>
>
>  Phil
> Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Sent: Sat, November 13, 2010 7:07:58 PM
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: PCC Left turn Smithfield to 6th!
>
> There's a lot wrong with the identifying material accompanying this 
> image.
> First, the car is turning from 6th Street onto Liberty Avenue.
> Second, it's attributed to the Pittsburgh Railways Company holdings.
> At that time, the railfan photographer called himself the "Pittsburgh 
> Railways Company" and even had letterheads reading it.
> Third, the route was around long before 1940.  The University has been 
> once again been misinformed...it's not part of the actual PRCo 
> records.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of 
> Phillip Clark Campbell
> Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 5:06 PM
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Subject: [PRCo] PCC Left turn Smithfield to 6th!
>
> http://tinyurl.com/1537-87-1965
> "View of PCC car 1537 making a left turn from Smithfield Street to 6th 
> Avenue.
> The 87 Ardmore route existed from 1940  to 1967.
> It was discontinued as a result of Port Authority  modernization."
>
> Phil
> Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

--
Herb Brannon
In Cuyahoga Valley National Park