[PRCo] Re: Washington Interurban Forensics

[Dwight Long]

Phil

The key is whether or not the track shown, which is open track, goes on in the distance as single track into the street.  At first I did not even notice the street.  If the track does go onto the street, which seems a reasonable hypothesis—particularly given the Nachod OHL contactor in the fot—it narrows down the potential locations on both PRC interurban lines.

WASHINGTON: There is nothing that would qualify between Canonsburg and Washington Junction.  As I stated before, this cannot be at the north end of Canonsburg, which you confirmed by noting that entrance was double track.  The double track ended in Canonsburg south of the wye.  However, the first siding south of Canonsburg, where all track was in the street, was McGovern siding, just south of Houston.  In Houston the track came south off the street onto a trestle which was PRW and beyond (south of) which lay McGovern.  Therefore that location is ruled out.  As I recall (almost sixty years later) the track in Meadowlands was s/r prw.  If I’m right about that, and there is street track involved beyond the siding, that seems to eliminate this route, as there don’t seem to be any other locations with the right configuration of track and street.

CHARLEROI:  A  possible contender would be the northbound south entrance to Finleyville, although that doesn’t seem right because the siding south of that town was Mingo School and I believe it was too far south to have had the street running in the background.  I may be wrong about this. I’m wondering if the south end of Monongahela might be the location, where the double track north of Black Diamond ended?  The next possibility would be the south end of Charleroi looking north from the first siding south of the street running on McKean Avenue.  South of there to Elco the track was all S/R or PRW.

So, by process of elimination it would appear that the locus of the fot is on the Charleroi, not Washington, line.  Is that not what Ed opined (I’ve already deleted his email on the subject)?  Someone else can take a look at the potentials I’ve suggested for that route and maybe zero in on the target.

Dwight


From: Phillip Clark Campbell 
Sent: Wednesday, 07 December, 2011 22:19
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org 
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Washington Interurban Forensics
Mr.Long;

A little information for clarity.  Someone suggested a location not
far south of Drake trestle.  With paved track in the background
this is impossible isn't it.  The reference to Canonsburg is to
indicate the first location with paved track, "not" to identify a 

possible location for the photo.  Additionally, Canonsburg is
double track isn't it; track in the photo is single in the street.


This photo was extensively discussed some time back; I saw it
in the archives.  No one was able to identify it at that time; it
was thought to be on the Charleroi interurban.

The 38A does not have street running does it.  It can't be there.

The Interurbans are US&S as you mention which includes
Charleroi.  There are locations where nachod seems to do the
job as well or where complete block signalling is not needed.
Certainly street operations rule out US&S; short sections of
single track might over rule this need as well.  There are many
locations along Washington where Nachod are used and
street running is not immediately apparent.


http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/02-1614%2036+%20194605xx%201.jpg

Finding these pictures is difficult.



Phil




________________________________
From: Dwight Long <dwightlong at verizon.net>
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org 
Sent: Wednesday, December 7, 2011 6:20 PM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Washington Interurban Forensics
 

Phil

If it is Canonsburg, it has to be on the south side of Canonsburg, inasmuch 
as the entry to the north side was over Richfol trestle.

If in fact we are looking at street trackage in the distant background, that 
would explain the Nachod OHL contactor above the track next to the car. 
Perhaps someone could check out the south end of Canonsburg to see if there 
is a fit.  That is about the only place on the Washington line I can think 
of that might work.  Otherwise it may be, as Ed says, on the Charleroi 
line--a couple of locations there might fit this shot.

Sent from my portable computer where all I have to go by is my memory--no 
maps or other data!

Dwight

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Phillip Clark Campbell" <pcc_sr at yahoo.com>
To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2011 3:32 PM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Washington Interurban Forensics

> Mr.Iannucci;
> There is street operation in the background on single track. The
> first street operation south of Drake trestle was in Canonsburg, double
> track.
>
>
> Phil
>
> ________________________________
>>
>> Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:
>> In the archives is a picture of an old car that no one on this list can
>> identify isn't there. It is reportedly on the Interurban lines. A PCC was
>> also photographed at the same location. It is tedious trying to find the
>> photo in the archives. This looks like the photo in the archives,
>> again, location unidentified by anyone:
>> http://www.davesrailpix.com/pitts/htm/wvp009.htm
>>
> From: Bob Iannucci <bob at rail.com>
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
> Sent: Wednesday, December 7, 2011 1:09 PM
> Subject: [PRCo] Washington Interurban Forensics
>
> This is a really intriguing picture - I had never seen it before. The lay
> of the roadbed behind the car, the direction of the track, and the 
> location
> of the poles match a location in Upper St. Clair, just southwest of the
> former Drake Trestle.   The area is now called Wiltshire Park. Analysis of
> old maps shows that a walking path in that park was once part of the
> roadbed of the former Washington Interurban line. On my trip to Pittsburgh
> this summer, I shot photos of that area. The poles are long gone, but
> there is still pretty clear evidence of them on the right hand side
> (relative to the direction in which the car in the picture is traveling) 
> of
> the former roadbed. The widening of the walking path in that area now
> corresponds to the passing siding we see in the picture from the 1940's.
> Can anyone say if there was a passing siding just southwest of the
> Trestle? The area is overgrown now, but when I was growing up in Upper St.
> Clair in the 1960's, this area was just brush as in the 1940's photo.
>
> I've made up the attached for your review - to give you some context and 
> to
> invite analysis of these two pictures. Were they shot at the same
> location? At present, the evidence is somewhat thin. Any information to
> prove or disprove this will be appreciated.
>
> If anyone can find the picture of the PCC taken at the same location (as
> mentioned above), I'd really appreciate it. Also, I am looking for *any*
> photos of the former Washington interurban line in the area from Drake to
> the southwest edge of Upper St. Clair.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bob
>
> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/Interurban%20Forensics.pdf