[PRCo] PRCo Route 59

Tue Jul 9 21:51:09 EDT 2013

Ray

I have not seen the phot to which you refer.  Could you resend it?

Dwight

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ray" <rayprco53 at verizon.net>
To: "Western PA Trolley discussion" 
<pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 8:06 PM
Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59

> Regarding 55A, roll sign reads Homestead Braddock via 2 Ave. What is 
> missing is E. Pgh. So i would assume it went to Braddock. Thats the 
> pictures that i have.  Is the rollsign maybe a fan trip sign?
>
> Sent from my LG Smartphone on Sprint
>
> Dwight Long <dwightlong at verizon.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>Ray
>>
>>I don't understand the question.  It used the Munhall loop to turn back
>>toward Pittsburgh, just as the 65 used it to turn back to Lincoln Place.
>>55A did not go to Braddock.  That was the 55 itself.
>>
>>Dwight
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: "Ray" <rayprco53 at verizon.net>
>>To: "Western PA Trolley discussion"
>><pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org>
>>Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 5:01 PM
>>Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59
>>
>>
>>> Regarding 55A, how was the turn around Munhall loop? If it was how did 
>>> it
>>> get to Braddock?
>>>
>>> Sent from my LG Smartphone on Sprint
>>>
>>> Dwight Long <dwightlong at verizon.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Ray
>>>>
>>>>Same as 55, except outer end was Munhall Loop (and in summers 1958 and
>>>>prior
>>>>at Kennywood Park).
>>>>
>>>>Dwight
>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: "Lattner, Raymond" <rlattner at pa.gov>
>>>>To: "Western PA Trolley discussion"
>>>><pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org>
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 12:50 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Since you guys brought up routes 65 and 55 trackage, can someone 
>>>>> provide
>>>>> the route of 55A?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I now agree probably a coal rr on that side.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oh one more thing, I was going through all my photos and I do not have 
>>>>> a
>>>>> low floor type car with
>>>>> a Forbes Field destination. Has anyone seen a photo of a low floor 
>>>>> type
>>>>> car with this destination?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ray
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounces at mailman.dementix.org
>>>>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounces at mailman.dementix.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>> John Swindler
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 12:36 PM
>>>>> To: Western PA Trolley discussion
>>>>> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Wasn't the 65 extension via Rankin Bridge to E. Pgh. when 58 and 55
>>>>> converted to bus by PAT???  Might be due to Glenwood bridge - or might
>>>>> have been due to repaving of last mile of Second Ave. track east of
>>>>> Greenfield Ave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Going to guess summer of 1964.  PAT had bought 150 new GM buses, but
>>>>> story
>>>>> I heard was that some of the buses from independents were much worse
>>>>> than
>>>>> expected. Otherwise 65 would not have lasted a bit longer.
>>>>>
>>>>> There was an 'owl' car that ran S. Hills. Jct. out Second Ave. to
>>>>> Munhall
>>>>> Loop (E. Pgh???) , then to Lincoln Place, back to Munhall and then
>>>>> returned to S. Hills. Jct.  There were a bunch of PRMA members on that
>>>>> last trip, but I managed to doze off around 4 a.m. and have no
>>>>> recollection passing thru West Homestead on return trip.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> From: dwightlong at verizon.net
>>>>>> To: pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
>>>>>> Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2013 11:50:00 -0400
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fred
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The final change to route 65, other than its discontinuance as a rail
>>>>>> operation, was its extension from Munhall Loop to East Pittsburgh 
>>>>>> over
>>>>>> the former route 55 trackage.  Not sure when this occurred (when the
>>>>>> Glenwood bridge was closed to trams) but it was in effect, AIR, until
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> end of tram operations from Lincoln Place.  I took pictures of the
>>>>>> operation in early 1965.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dwight
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: Fred Schneider
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, 09 July, 2013 11:35
>>>>>> To: Western PA Trolley discussion
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRCo Route 59
>>>>>> Route cards for route 506 Homestead and Homeville show the following
>>>>>> (if
>>>>>> I transcribed it correctly) ... never did find anyone willing to
>>>>>> proofread my work.   There are certain dates such as 1930 and 1937
>>>>>> where
>>>>>> they simply listed the routes even if they didn't change so the dates
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> not always indicative of a change unless it is so stated.   Usually a
>>>>>> change only shows the specific streets that were changed.  fws
>>>>>>
>>>>>> January 1902 ... from a point in Homeville along a township road
>>>>>> through
>>>>>> Munhall to 9th Avenue in Homestead and over 8th Avenue to Hays 
>>>>>> Street.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1917:  From a point in Homeville-Greenspring Avenue, Ravine Street, 
>>>>>> 8th
>>>>>> Avenue to Hays Street.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> July 17 to July 19, 1919;  August 29 to Sept 1, 1919 and August 18 to
>>>>>> August 22, 1919 ... line split into two sections at bridge above
>>>>>> Homeville Siding because of unsafe condition of bridge,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> August 10, 1925:  Length of line:  round trip 5.23 miles.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> May 14, 1927 to June 19, 1927:  Shuttle service from Terrace Step 
>>>>>> stop
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> end of line, Homeville.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Feb. 14, 1928:  Route 506 combined with route 507 
>>>>>> (Homestead-Mifflin).
>>>>>> One man operation began.   See route 507 for history 1928 to 1944.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> July 9, 1944:  Began operation from Homeville to 18th and West 
>>>>>> Streets.
>>>>>> Route 65 operating SE PCC cars from Munhall Loop to Lincoln Place 
>>>>>> loop.
>>>>>> Route 59 used double end low-floor cars.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> March 7, 1953:  Last full day of route 59.
>>>>>> ______________________________________________________________________
>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Original route 507 operated only November 1902.  Have not found route
>>>>>> card.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> April 1, 1928:   On this date, route 507 started under supervision of
>>>>>> Pittsburgh Railways Company using schedules and equipment formerly 
>>>>>> used
>>>>>> by Homestead and Mifflin Street Railway.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> August 24, 1928:  Shuttle began operating between Lincoln Place and
>>>>>> Main
>>>>>> and McWhinney, also Main and McWhinney and 8th Avenue, Homestead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> November 21, 1928:   Through cars Lincoln Place to 13th and West
>>>>>> Streets,
>>>>>> Homestead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> November 23, 1928:  Through cars Lincoln Place to 8th and West Sts.,
>>>>>> Homestead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> December 14, 1928:  Combined with route 506 Homeville and one-man
>>>>>> operation began.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> January 1, 1930:  Main St., Center Ave., Main St., Walnut Ave., 22nd
>>>>>> Ave., West St., Amity St., 8th Ave., Munhall St., Ravine St.,
>>>>>> Greenspring
>>>>>> Ave. to Hays St. in Homeville.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> March 15, 1937:  Lincoln Place along Interboro Avenue and Main St. to
>>>>>> West St. to 12th St., Amith., 8th Ave., Munhall Junction, Ravine St.,
>>>>>> Greenspring Ave. to High St.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> July 9, 1944:   Homeville end split from Lincoln Place end and
>>>>>> designated
>>>>>> route 59.   Lincoln Place to Munhall loop designated route 65.
>>>>>> Muldfowney Loop in Lincoln Place opened this date permitting PCC
>>>>>> service
>>>>>> on route 65 and the line was extended eastward a short distance from
>>>>>> Interboro Avenue to Muldowney Street.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> October 31, 1956 Transit Guide:  Munhall to Lincoln Place over 8th
>>>>>> Avenue
>>>>>> in Munhall and McKeesport, Amity St., 12th St., West St., 22nd St.,
>>>>>> Interboro Ave. and private right-of-way to Muldowney Loop. 
>>>>>> Unchanged
>>>>>> from July 9, 1944.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sept. 5, 1965:  Last full day of service route 65.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 9, 2013, at 9:52 AM, Lattner, Raymond wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > Hello. I was looking at an older historic topo map and noticed that
>>>>>> > route 59 traveled up Ravine Street and then split at  the
>>>>>> > intersection
>>>>>> > of Greensprings  Ave., Coal  Rd and Black Path (road names based on
>>>>>> > Google Maps).
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > One line continued up Greensprings Ave. to what is called Terrace
>>>>>> > and ends at what  I believe is High Street and Bowes Ave. The other
>>>>>> > line on PRW seems to follow  Duquesne Ave then Homestead Duquesne 
>>>>>> > Rd
>>>>>> > to
>>>>>> > Coal Rd. to terminate at Coal  Rd. Extension and Bellwood Rd.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > I have attached that section of the map. My first question is, is
>>>>>> > this correct?  If so, how did these lines operate and what
>>>>>> > destinations
>>>>>> > signs were used?  When did PRCo stop using the line to Bellwood 
>>>>>> > Rd.?
>>>>>> > Maybe I have this wrong and it could be a coal mine RR?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > If this was discussed before I apologize.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Oh, map web site in case some of you do not have it.
>>>>>> > http://geonames.usgs.gov/pls/topomaps/f?p=262:1:4149522851964442
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Thanks.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Raymond E. Lattner
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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