[PRCo] Traditional Department Store Issues

Mon Oct 28 18:17:10 EDT 2013

Phil

Grace Brothers had better customer service than that which has been quoted in these exchanges but even that did not save them.

Changing times.  People are people but the times they are a changing--and always will.

Dwight
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: PC 
  To: Western PA Trolley discussion 
  Sent: Monday, October 28, 2013 8:09 AM
  Subject: Re: [PRCo] Burning Leaves--and Coal

  This is not unlike what Mr.Rathke says:  "We all have our computer stories."
  We all have our retail horror stories.  People are people world wide.
  People are people in the high-society stores as well.  It is beneath
  their dignity to serve a commoner isn't it.  TV sitcoms are made of such.
  Dad always said:  "It takes two to Tango."
  Such stories are never one-sided are they.

  This speaks more of prejudice doesn't it, and even more strongly of exaggeration.
  This list trains one to overlook--no, to dismiss, the vast majority written.
  There is also a 'good ol' boys' network:  "I'll slap your back if you slap my back."
  It goes on and on doesn't it.

  Another old saying of yore:  "When in Rome do as Romans do."  'Inexpensive'
  works very nicely doesn't it.  But one can not see the 'sophistication' unless
  we speak multiple foreign languages and, of course, denigrate our own country.
  Why not move?  It is the wife-thing.  "I would, of course, but she does not want
  so to do.  Family, you know."

  With all the evidence here in this email alone let alone in the list in general
  maybe dancing with the stars is where one could excel.  The messages may
  contain good information but it is difficult to find with all the two-stepping.
  Answering a question sees comments all around the topic but never addressing same.

  As a good friend would say to end his conversation:  "And on we go!"
  Maybe that is:  "On and on and:"

  PC

  --------------------------------------------
  On Sun, 10/27/13, Herb Brannon <hrbran at cavtel.net> wrote:

   Subject: Re: [PRCo] Burning Leaves--and Coal
   To: "Western PA Trolley discussion" <pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org>
   Date: Sunday, October 27, 2013, 9:31 AM

   You know Fred, you sure know how to "baffle with b.s."

   On Sun, Oct 27, 2013 at 12:16 PM, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net>wrote:

   > Herb, I am not insulting Adam
   Gimbel. I am using "cheap" in the English
   > language sense, not the way the American's have
   adulterated it to mean
   > "crappy" or "no good". It means
   economical, as in the "cheap day return
   > ticket" in Britain … translated means the bargain one
   day round trip ticket.
   >
   > Gimbels was the cheap (bargain) store but they were not
   in a position to
   > compete with the likes of WalMart and it this area they
   were the first
   > department store to fold. If I had to
   make a comparison, it would be the
   > British Home Store … yes I have a favorite shirt with
   a BHS label. That's
   > what happens when you vacationed so many times in
   Britain.
   >
   > Sadly, Gimbels was not only the economical store but
   locally they had some
   > of the worst help too. He could not
   stay in business when WalMart or
   > K-Mart had no help and he was paying for
   doofuses. I remember one day I
   > went into the Gimbels store to buy something for my
   wife. A friend who
   > was a PennDOT attorney was with me. He
   had just returned from a vacation
   > in Japan. I could not get any of the
   sales girls to wait on me. They
   > were all having a hen party. So I lead Gareth
   over until we were within
   > hearing range of the goofing off sales clerks, and then
   looked at him and
   > said, "Is it true what you told me … that in Japan
   the sales clerks
   > actually are hired to wait on the
   customers?" He played it to the hilt
   > and those girls went balistic. How
   dare you insult them by expecting them
   > to work. They told us off at full
   volume. And naturally, we went to
   > another store in the mall. I think I
   saw some other customers evacuating
   > Adam Gimbel's store.
   >
   > I think there were some other problems
   too. Each region operated
   > independently. My charge card for
   Gimbels in Lancaster was only good in
   > the Philadelphia region stores. It was
   not valid in Pittsburgh or
   > Chicago. It might get immediate
   clearance for a temporary card there but
   > I had to apply there if I wanted credit.
   >
   > Of course, doesn't matter. They are
   gone.
   >
   > Saks? No such thing
   here. Nearest is in King of
   Prussia. And I
   > never heard of a Barneys…. New York store isn't it?
   >
   > Lancaster County, Pa., was an area that thrived
   through the 1980s and
   > then crashed. For many years we had
   lower wage rates than the national
   > average, which means it isn't the place people who want
   really high wages
   > come but it might be where a corporation wants to come
   to build a factory.
   > All through the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s,
   one company after another came here
   > to exploit the cheap labor and the "Amish work
   ethic." The result was a
   > doubling of the population from 1950 to 2000. But
   when you stress the
   > local economy and push the unemployment rate down to
   half the national
   > unemployment rate (it was actually as low here as 1.4
   percent in the summer
   > of 1964), that puts extreme pressure on
   wages. They rose. Unions become
   > popular. So popular that one by one
   the factories close and the
   > corporations decide we don't don't need this
   shit. This was a major
   > garment manufacturing center … all those plants
   closed. Roughly 10,000
   > shoe, garment and textile jobs
   vanished. Those jobs went first to Mexico
   > under the North American Free Trade Agreement and then
   to China and
   > southeast Asia. A lot of recreational
   vehicle plants were built here in
   > the 1980s … we decided fuel is too expensive to tow
   those trailers so those
   > plant closed. Armstrong once employed
   several thousand people here making
   > linoleum and other resilient floor coverings …. they
   still do it but in
   > right-to-work states and in new plants on one
   floor. In the 1960s RCA had
   > about 3000 people building color TV sets here and in
   Wilkes-Barre; then
   > they were introduced to Sony. Hamilton
   Watch used to employ almost 2000
   > people making watches … no one wants quality watches
   … the last remnant of
   > the company was sold to a Swiss firm … they're "out
   of here" and the
   > building is an apartment now. We still
   have manufacturing but its about
   > half the number of workers we had in that sector in
   1970. We now have
   > unemployment over 6% and routine shootings and
   burglaries as a means of
   > supporting each other … it's called income
   transfer. We no longer have
   > any upper end stores. We don't have as
   many upper income people today.
   > I guess they're in Dallas today. But
   at my age, no reason to move.
   >
   > The sad thing about the crash here, Herb, was unlike
   Pittsburgh, it
   > affected a young population to begin
   with. When steel went down in 1982
   > in Pittsburgh, it wasn't something new. They
   already had 20 years of
   > on-again, off-again problems with the mills. 
   Allegheny County's population
   > was relatively stable after 1930 in the 1.4 to 1.6
   million range. It
   > actually began dropping from 1.629 million in 1960 to
   1.450 million before
   > the big collapse of steel in 1982 … the kids were
   already leaving home and
   > going where the jobs were. You cannot
   have really high unemployment when
   > people go directly from working to pensions … they
   are out of the labor
   > force.
   >
   > But Lancaster was still growing rapidly when our crash
   came. We had
   > 212,000 in 1940 and 423,000 in 1990 when things began
   to soften, 471,000 in
   > 2000 and 519,000 in 2010. Part of the
   anomaly of a tapering economy along
   > with growth is that we have also found ourselves within
   commuting distance
   > of Philadelphia's suburban job market and now the same
   for the northeastern
   > suburbs of Baltimore. For a while,
   until the state began to decide they
   > didn't want workers, the northwestern part of this
   county was also
   > attractive for people working in the state capital …
   only 20 minutes away
   > on the train. Trouble is, Herb, if
   that guy gets laid off in Philadelphia
   > he is still among the 6.5% unemployed in
   Lancaster. And, as you can see
   > from those numbers, we have over 50,000 homes built in
   the last 40 years ….
   > not the same as someone who built a house in
   Pittsburgh in 1935. When
   > you have a couple who built a house in 1990 and the
   area crashes and they
   > still have a mortgage, you have problems.

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