M454?

[Fred W. Schneider III]

I'm glad, Ken, that you jumped in here.  You make sense. 

The North Shore was maintaining their cars as if the line would go on
forever, even though they fought for at least four years to shut down. 
On the last day early in 1963, the paint shop crews finished up a car
that would go to the scrap line (or perhaps it was preserved).  But you
did have a chance of getting a reasonably well maintained car from the
North Shore.  Same was true of Los Angeles.  In the SCRTD era you could
tell when the former LATL people lost control of South Park Shops in the
late 1970s and a PE man took over; the maintenance level dropped.

Maybe 1711 was no better than any other 1700 at the end, and maybe it
was.  But remember, none of them were ever rewired.  It will take a
whole new body from the frame down to make that car good.

   

Kenneth Josephson wrote:
> 
> I also wish to add there is often a dilemma faced by trolley museums when a decision
> is made to save a piece of equipment: Do you save a particular car because it was the
> last to run or a fan favorite? Or do you save the car in the best condition which is
> the most representative of the company or the car series?
> 
> IRM could have saved NSL 150, the first of the system's famous high speed steel
> coaches. The 150 had been heavily modified due to a fire or accident (I am not sure
> which.) Sister car 160 was in the best condition of the series, was close to original
> condition and had a more recent overhaul, so it was obtained instead. Ditto for a
> representative of the last of the steel high speed coaches. Car 776 was the last
> standard interurban coach built for the NSL, outshopped by Standard Steel Car in
> 1930. But it was due for a major overhaul and the Museum's board believed slightly
> older, but recently overhauled Pullman car 749 was a better candidate to represent
> the newest heavyweights. As it turned out, 160 and 749 still needed much work and a
> later acquisition of NSL Standard Steels 757 and 763 from East Troy indicated the
> Museum's initial decision was a sound one.
> 
> Milwaukee's last electric scheduled transit vehicle was a TC-44 Marmon-Herrington
> trolley coach, number 428. Again, IRM could have acquired this historic vehicle.
> Sister coach 441, however, was in much better condition (I rode in it last summer
> with Bob Rathke. We were running up and down the dirt road known as Central Avenue at
> IRM and this coach did not squeak or rattle, even at a relatively good clip!) The
> decision was made to spare 441 and let 428 go to Mexico City, where it also required
> a major overhaul in time to remain in service.
> 
> Now I've been told 1711 was not the best 1700 interurban for PTM to preserve, but it
> was the last scheduled car on the Washington line. There was a historic tie to the
> line it travels today. So that factored into its being rescued by PTM. Perhaps when
> that car eventually receives the same attention as 1138  is receiving now, there will
> be some members mumbling under their breath about the decision to save 1711 instead
> of say, 1713 which went elsewhere. But remember, all these cars were pretty rough for
> most of their lives. Oldtimers tell me choosing 1138 was a true case of choosing the
> least of many evils. Some wanted 1111 simply because it was the"Four Aces" and
> because of the famous snow shot we have all seen of it (a great photo, by the way.)
> :-)
> 
> Another example is museum politics. PRCo. 100 (M-11) is a very sore spot. The very
> first production PCC to run in service ***anywhere.***  The car was lost. IRM saved
> two Milwaukee Electric interurban cars that were heavily modified in the 1920s, but
> refused to preserve some freight motors from Michigan's UP becuase they were heavily
> modified. Go figure.
> 
> Ken J.