[PRCo] Re: To PCC or Not to PCC?.......That is the Question.

[Jim Holland]

Good Morning!!

> Kenneth Josephson wrote:

> There are those who insist the St. Louis built Red Arrow Cars and the Muni Magic
> Carpet units were PCCs (they weren't) and that the CTA  "Spam Cans" were not
> PCCs (they were.)

	And this is upheld by the PCC books as well.   Some locals said they discovered some
secret papers indicating that the royalties were made a part of the purchase price because
a SF ordinance prevented the city from paying royalties on transit or other equipment.  
So there  *may*  be some justification to calling the Magic Carpets PCCs.
	Those MCs that used Brill trucks were not PCCs, but for all practical purposes the other
cars were.   Red Arrow cars used MCB trucks which excludes them from being PCCs, Yes?

> 1.) Suppose TARS, Milwaukee Electric or the Key System decided to go a step
> further and had ordered all new PCC trucks, controls and passenger equipment
> from the various suppliers to rebuild some of their older cars?  Would
> these have become PCCs?

	This sounds similar to the Gomaco Council Crest Cars, but certainly not the same.   It
would  *seem*  that the definition depends on  *Original--Building.*   TrolleyCars can be
modified  after--the--fact  to include PCC equipment, but this would not necessarily
qualify the car as a PCC.

> 2.) If somebody finds a Birney body in a barn (or doing duty as a shed),
> fabricates a truck, and gets the thing running without the original style safety
> equipment (controls), is it no longer a Birney?

	Tougher question.   It is  *representative*  of the Birney car   ---   how's that   (for
dodging the question?)

	It seems that  *at least 2-factors*  affect definitions::  1)--We live in an imperfect
world and  2)--Definitions seem circular.

	*WE*  associate The term  *Interurban*  with  PE,  North Shore,  CA&E,  OE,  C&LE, 
BCER,  etc., etc., etc.   But the term is equally applicable to motor coaches, even
railroads.   It is transit between two cities and in the case of rail equipment like PE,
it is mostly on prw!

	The term  *streetcar*  is defined as a vehicle that provides transit in a city while
operating in the streets.   This can include a  horse--car,  cable--car,  trolleycar, 
battery--car,  etc., etc., etc.

	Now, then, to be perfectly specific about the type of interurban of which one speaks, do
we say  *Interurban--trolleycar??*   Seems like a misnomer since trolleycars run mostly on
streets and interurbans mostly on prw.

	And an acceptable definition of  *Light--Rail*  centers on infrastructure (not
weight--tonnage) and states that light rail contains mostly prw (grade separation) but
possibly  *some*  street running.

	So it seems that some terms can  cross--pollinate  other terms.

	Takes yer choice   ---   don't know who said that!

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

James B. Holland

Holland  Electric  Railway  Operation.......
......"O"--Scale  St.-Petersburg Trams Company Trolleycars  AND......
............"O"--Scale  Parts  mailto:pghpcc at pacbell.net

............Pennsylvania Trolley Museum (PTM) http://www.pa-trolley.org/
......Pittsburgh  Railways  Company  (PRCo),   1930  --  1950
N.M.R.A.  Life member #2190; http://www.nmra.org

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>