[PRCo] Re: PCC___Quiz

Sun Nov 23 06:07:11 EST 2003

Good Morning!

> Boris Cefer wrote:

> We have first quiz here. What surprise! I'm answering
> what I know.    You will see what I don't know and
> then you can provide appropriate information.

>> From: "Jim Holland" <PghPCC at pacbell.net>

>> 01.>-- How many bolts in the All-Electric Track Brake?

>> 	Westinghouse??

>> 	GE??

> Haven't chance to compare WAB and GE, but WAB seem to
> have 4 bolts.    And was there any significant difference?

	Don't know myself  --  was actually asking you for the answer!!!

>> 02.>-- How many PRCo PCCs had fans?

> 1 and 100 units - 1600 and 1700s.

	ALL  PRCo PCCs had fans  --  MG, heater, motor, etc.!    Sorry,
trick question!

>> 04.>-- What spring tension is recommended by Ohio Brass
>> for trolley poles with wheels and at what wire height?

> Unfortunately, haven't seen any specification yet.

	30-32--pounds, 18--feet.

>> 08.>-- Which PRCo PCCs had  *Butterfly__Windows?*

> Front windows. 100, 1000s, 1100s and 1200s.

	14s and 15s  --  vent cutout in upper outside edge of each front
window gives butterfly appearance.

>> 14.>-- Which PRCo PCC cars had St. Louis B3 trucks?

> Original equipment: 1700-1724, 1615-1619, 1645-1648;
> 1613 and 1614 were experimental, but delivered with B-2s.
> Some early experimental B-3s were under 1230 (have a
> picture of 1225 with the first experimental set of B-3s)
> and 1278.

	Actually,  ALL  16s were delivered with B2s.    Those later set
aside for Interurban service were retrofitted with air-operated
B3s.

>> 15.>-- How many rivets in the body of the standard PRCo
>> PCC Car?

> PCC structure is welded!

	That's why I asked the question!!

>> 18.>-- Which PRCo PCCs were sent to foreign properties
>> to stay?    Which cars to which Properties?

> PRCo did not sell used PCCs.    But lend 1095 to Cleveland
> and 1253 to Louissville for demobstrating service.
> 1264 was displayed on flatcar in Buffalo.

	Was looking for fact that 1547 was pulled from production line
and sent to Twin Cities.    Also 1674 and 1675 were pulled from
production and sent to Detroit.    This is reason to ask for date
of receipt of many 16s later.

>> 25.>-- On what date was PCC-1138 received by PRCo???

	1937.11.19

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1937.11.23

	Sold to P.E.R.C 1961.03.29;
		Moved To Arden 1961.04.05

>> 31.>-- On what date was PCC-1564 received by PRCo???

	1945.02.19

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.02.24

>> 32.>-- On what date was PCC-1547 received by PRCo???

	1945.08.03

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.08.08

	Car 1547 was received after 1602 was received (1945.08.02,) the
first of the 16s.    Cars 1547 and 1602 went into service on the
same date and about 5.5-months after 1564.

>> 33.>-- What 1500-series cars were renumbered by
>>	 PRCo in 1947?

	1547-2 and 1505 were interchanged.

>> 	Why?

	Quoting my roster notes::

	""1st-1547 diverted from order by SLCCo, sent to Twin Cities as
demonstrator 3000 (later 299 and still later Mexico City
2299.)    2nd-1547 built with 1600s.    1st-1505 and 2nd-1547
switched numbers in 1947 in order to group drum-brake equipped
cars in the group 1500--1505.    Present 2nd-1505 is ex-2nd-1547,
3rd-1547 is ex-1st-1505.""

	I have pictures of 1547 in South Hills in the yard and
apparently in-service on the 49-line.    Car still has
wheel-tread brakes so it could be 3rd-1547-ex-1505 and post-1947,
but since it looks quite new, it is probably pre-1947 and
2nd-1547!

	I have a suspicion that 1547-2  *may*  have been delivered with
drum-brakes ala 1600s since it was built with these cars.    But
not certain.    The 1600s were definitely the first cars to be
delivered without wheel-tread brakes.

>> 34.>-- On what date was PCC-1601 received by PRCo???

	1945.08.05

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.08.10

>> 35.>-- On what date was PCC-1600 received by PRCo???

	1945.09.05

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.09.18

>> 36.>-- On what date was PCC-1600 destroyed???

> 18th May 1955 - Homewood fire. Cont. 37.

>> 	On what date was PCC-1600 scrapped???

	1955.07.26

>> 37.>-- On what date was PCC-1613 received by PRCo???

	1945.08.13

>> What date did this car go into service???

	1945.08.25 as City Car.

>> What date did this car go into Washigton
>>	Interurban Service???

> In 1946, but don't know if the date January 14th which
> I remember for some reason is correct. Cont. 48.

	I have heard 1945.01.26.

>> 38.>-- On what date was PCC 1673 received by PRCo???

	1945.10.20

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.10.25

>> 39.>-- On what date was PCC 1674 received by PRCo???

	1946.01.28

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1946.02.20

>> 40.>-- On what date was PCC 1675 received by PRCo???

	1945.10.18  --  GE car 2-days before Westinghouse-1673!

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.10.31

>> 41.>-- On what date was PCC 1676 received by PRCo???

	1945.10.18

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.10.31

>> 42.>-- On what date was PCC 1698 received by PRCo???

	1945.12.06

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1945.12.20

>> 43.>-- On what date was PCC 1699 received by PRCo???

	1946.01.14

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1946.01.31

	With 1674 and 1675 shipped to Detroit, and with 1675 being first
in GE series, apparently numbering of cars picked up immediately
with 1675 as there is no break in delivery dates and, as
mentioned above, 1675 actually arrived 2-days before 1673.

	There are 7-days between delivery of 1696 and 1697 with 10-days
between 1697 and 1698.

	Because 2-cars were shipped out to Detroit, 2-more bodies were
needed and there is a jump of 42-days between 1698 and 1699 with
another 14-days before 1674 arrived.

>> 44.>-- On what date was PCC 1700 received by PRCo???

	1948.11.30

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1948.12.07

>> 45.>-- On what date was PCC 1701 received by PRCo???

	1949.01.18

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1949.01.26

>> 46.>-- On what date was PCC 1702 received by PRCo???

	1949.01.26

>> 	What date did this car go into service???

	1949.01.31

>> 47.>-- On what date was PCC 1799 received by PRCo???

	1949.05.31

>> 	What date did PCCs 1796--1799 inclusive
>> 		go into service???

1796	1949.05.12	1949.05.27
1797	1949.05.16	1949.05.27
1798	1949.05.23	1949.07.27
1799	1949.05.31	1949.07.27

	Were it not for the big gap between delivery and in-service for
1799, I would believe that the in-service date for 1798 would be
incorrect as it  *could*  have gone into service on 1949.05.27
with the other two of that date.

>> 50.>-- What are the axle centers on the PRCo B2B truck???

> I hope that B-2B has the same wheelbase as the B-2,
> but haven't seen any drawing or specification.

	Your wish is granted!!

>> 51.>-- What are kingpin centers on the PRCo 1700s???

> 22' 9".

>> 52.>-- What are kingpin centers on the PRCo Air-Cars.

> The same. Cont. 57.

>> 53.>-- What is length from kingpin center to front end
>> 	of PRCo 1700s???

	12--feet, 6_11/16--inches

>> 54.>-- What is length from kingpin center to front end
>> of PRCo Air-Cars???

	12--feet, 1.5--inches

>> 55.>-- What is length from kingpin center to back end
>> of PRCo 1700s???

	11--feet, 1_11/16--inches

>> 56.>-- What is length from kingpin center to back end
>> of PRCo Air-Cars???

	11--feet, 1.5--inches.

>> 59.>-- Which PRCo PCCs used the St.Louis Experimental
>> 	B3 trucks???

> 1230 (and 1225 as was mentioned above) and 1278 were the
> pioneer experimentals.    1613 and 1614 tested different
> B-3s later.

	Interurban 1613 is reported as using the trucks from 1278 (1952
Electric Railroads publication on PRCo Interurbans) thus 1614
received the trucks from 1230.

>> 63.>-- Which 100, 1000-1199  cars were fitted with
>> 	the wide anticlimber???

> Originally none.    But some of them (including the 100)
> received the full body-width anticlimber

	I have photos of Car-100 as Car-100 at Keating with full-width
anticlimber in 1948, well before it was converted to Instruction
car.    At least the following cars had the full-width
anti-climber before they were retired but the list is Not Limited
to these cars::::    1000,   1019,   1030,   1039,   1052,  
1063,   1066,   1069,   1073,   1079,   1091,   1096,   1098,  
1109,   1111,   1112,   1121,   1125,   1131,   1151,   1154,  
1157,   1161,   1162,   1170,   1178,   1190,   1196.

	Dave Hamley may have published a more detailed list and If I
Remember I shall try to look for same.

>> 68.>-- Where was the Retriever placed on PRCo PCC cars???

> I have chaos in the difference between retriever and
> catcher.    But if the retriever was used on interurbans,
> was mounted under the rear window to provide easy access.

	And retriever is to right of center.

	Catchers stop upward movement of dewired trolley pole.   
Crescent lever on back of take up spool is spring returned and
spins out from centrifugal force which then engages teeth around
the edge of the catcher.    This prevents flailing of pole into
spans until car is stopped although pole is probably not below
wire height.    Sometimes the pole will be pushed down with such
force upon hitting a span that it will be well below the span and
when it starts up again the catcher will catch it below wire
height so it looks like it is retrieved.

	A retriever is deeper and has the same crescent lever which
engages a large coiled spring within the takeup spool which then
winds the trolley rope back in and pulls the pole down below wire
height.

	Both catcher and retriever have a separate wound spring (not
unlike a  *Watch--Spring*  --  but you probably don't know what
that is, Young-Buck!) just inside the casing attached to the
wind-up spool that keeps nominal tension on the trolley rope.

>> 69.>-- Which PRCo PCCs sported dash lights???

> 1600s and 1700s.    Each light contained three bulbs.

	Also 1052 was retrofitted for same.    Picture on pg.6 of
March--April__1988  *Trolley__Fare.*

> A   SMALL   START!!!

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Waiting for a bus is as thrilling as fishing,
    with the similar tantalisation that something,
        sometime, somehow, will turn up. 
            George Courtauld

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

James B. Holland

• Holland  Electric  Railway  Operation....... 
  "O"--Scale St.-Petersburg Trams Company (SPTC)
	Trolleycars and "O"--Scale  Parts
		including Q-Car
	mailto:pghpcc at pacbell.net

• Pennsylvania Trolley Museum
	http://www.pa-trolley.org/
• Pittsburgh  Railways  Company  (PRCo),
	1930  --  1950
• N.M.R.A.  Life member #2190;
	http://www.nmra.org

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