[PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars

[Fred Schneider]

Minor correction Harold:  The New Orleans Canal Street cars do not have a
modified PCC truck.  They have a truck that was designed and built by
Brookville.  It happens to be the very same design that Brookville subsequently
used on the Philadephia PCC rebuilding.  My impression is that it is heavier
than a PCC truck but I have no idea what its weight actually is.  .

"Harold G." wrote:

> Greetings to John and all.
>
> PCC cars remain a good transit vehicle.
>
> I have used the rebuilt Brookville cars in Phila and
> they are good.  New Orleans Canal Street cars
> have a modified PCC truck.
>
> In Holland, the PCC truck was transferred to
> their artic cars in The Hague.  Rotterdam has
> new Alston and Amsterdam has new Siemens cars.
> The Hague also has a small group of used cars from
> Hannover.  These artics run every day and are from the
> late 60's and early 70's.  Budapest also acquired a
> large number of the Hannover cars.
>
> The Hague has wide Blvds befitting the capital city.
> Rotterdam was rebuilt new from World War II distruction.
> But Amsterdam is still like it was...and I like it better.
> Their first subway was along rr r/w and not too successful/
> Now they are building a second subway but with much
> distruction in the process.and at high cost.  Buses on the
> street would be worse
>
> The first two LRV's for Minneapolis were built in
> Mexico for Bombardier.  The body shells for the
> Boeing LRV came from Japan.  The CTA 2400
> bodies came from Portugal.
>
> The first San Diego LRV's came direct from
> Germany.  Edmonton and Calgary cars were built by Siemens in the Calgary
> shop.  Pgh LRV's were assembled to Blawnox, Pa.
> Make a good story someday to summarize all this.
>
> Bob D mentioned outsourcing to Central America.  One of the
> Airlines was Jet Blue.
>
> Harold Geissenheimer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Swindler <j_swindler at hotmail.com>
> To: transitmgr2 at earthlink.net <transitmgr2 at earthlink.net>
> Date: Monday, January 24, 2005 10:57 PM
> Subject: RE: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
>
> >
> >Hi Harold
> >
> >Just for the record, Harold, I don't have a problem with CAF and Elmira.
> >Actually, I'm harrassing Jim Holland a bit, who I've known for over 40
> >years.  However, Jim's mired in the PCC era.  I keep trying to nudge him a
> >bit towards LRV operations, so far without much success.
> >
> >The PCC was a good design, and it is what I grew up with in Pittsburgh.  I
> >have many fond memories, and am just a bit too young to remember the
> 'yellow
> >cars.'  But PCC was still a vehicle designed to last 20 years, and then be
> >replaced with the next generation rolling stock.  That's a paraphase from a
> >speech given by Dr. Hirschfeld of ERPCC to the AERA (today's APTA)
> >convention in 1935.
> >
> >My opinions go back to a trip to Holland in 1968.  Spent a day in The Hague
> >and enjoyed the fast PCC operation on reserved rights of way.  Spent a day
> >in Amsterdam and was not impressed with slow operation of Duewag cars on
> >city streets.  Then spent a final day in Rotterdam with fast Duewag
> >operation on reserved rights of way.  The conclusions of a 24 year old
> >American???  Try to avoid letting the rail vehicle get bogged down in city
> >traffic, and Duewag cars can give a better operator to passenger
> >productivity ratio.  And as for ride quality - not much difference.  PCC
> and
> >LRV can both provide comfortable, quick ride for passengers.  And I like
> the
> >Duewag rides in San Diego, St. Louis, Denver, Sacramento, and even
> >Pittsburgh.  (but the door operation is very slow)
> >
> >My regret?  Not making a lot more trips to Europe over the years.
> >
> >John
> >
> >
> >>From: "Harold G." <transitmgr2 at earthlink.net>
> >>Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >>To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> >>Subject: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> >>Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 13:44:43 -0500
> >>
> >>Greetings to all.   Was Elmira the rehaber of the
> >>Arden PCC cars?   Pretty good work.
> >>
> >>Why all this criticism of CAF and Elmira?
> >>
> >>I liked the CAF cars for Sacramento.  Also
> >>the Ring line cars for Amsterdam.
> >>
> >>Harold Geissenheimer
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: John Swindler <j_swindler at hotmail.com>
> >>To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> >>Date: Monday, January 24, 2005 9:47 AM
> >>Subject: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>James B. Holland asked:
> >> >>
> >> >>CAF  --  That's  CAlifornia, F-Line, San Francisco.......
> >> >>
> >> >>              Keerect??
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >try:
> >> >
> >> >http://www.caf.es/10/instalaciones.asp
> >> >
> >> >and it's practically in your back yard, Jim
> >> >
> >> >Looks like CAF also acquired the former Adtranz plant in Elmira.  And we
> >>all
> >> >know what got fixed up at this plant.
> >> >
> >> >John
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>John Swindler wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > CAF also has a plant in Sacramento. Suspect that there is more to
> >>this
> >> >> > saga that hasn't come out yet.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> From: "Boris Cefer" <westinghouse at iol.cz>
> >> >> >> Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >> >> >> To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> >> >> >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: [Fwd: FYI about PAT CAF cars]
> >> >> >> Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:39:37 +0100
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Any guess what the cost of the trip to Spain and back is?
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >