[PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars

[Fred Schneider]

They told their visitors that they created it.  Maybe I heard wrong.  If you
want to confirm, ask Bruce Bente and/or Russ Jackson.  We were all there
together.

John Swindler wrote:

> Didn't the truck design used by Brookville come from Germany, or was that
> just the control package????
>
> js
>
> >From: Fred Schneider <fschnei at supernet.com>
> >Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >Subject: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> >Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2005 20:08:11 -0500
> >
> >Minor correction Harold:  The New Orleans Canal Street cars do not have a
> >modified PCC truck.  They have a truck that was designed and built by
> >Brookville.  It happens to be the very same design that Brookville
> >subsequently
> >used on the Philadephia PCC rebuilding.  My impression is that it is
> >heavier
> >than a PCC truck but I have no idea what its weight actually is.  .
> >
> >"Harold G." wrote:
> >
> > > Greetings to John and all.
> > >
> > > PCC cars remain a good transit vehicle.
> > >
> > > I have used the rebuilt Brookville cars in Phila and
> > > they are good.  New Orleans Canal Street cars
> > > have a modified PCC truck.
> > >
> > > In Holland, the PCC truck was transferred to
> > > their artic cars in The Hague.  Rotterdam has
> > > new Alston and Amsterdam has new Siemens cars.
> > > The Hague also has a small group of used cars from
> > > Hannover.  These artics run every day and are from the
> > > late 60's and early 70's.  Budapest also acquired a
> > > large number of the Hannover cars.
> > >
> > > The Hague has wide Blvds befitting the capital city.
> > > Rotterdam was rebuilt new from World War II distruction.
> > > But Amsterdam is still like it was...and I like it better.
> > > Their first subway was along rr r/w and not too successful/
> > > Now they are building a second subway but with much
> > > distruction in the process.and at high cost.  Buses on the
> > > street would be worse
> > >
> > > The first two LRV's for Minneapolis were built in
> > > Mexico for Bombardier.  The body shells for the
> > > Boeing LRV came from Japan.  The CTA 2400
> > > bodies came from Portugal.
> > >
> > > The first San Diego LRV's came direct from
> > > Germany.  Edmonton and Calgary cars were built by Siemens in the Calgary
> > > shop.  Pgh LRV's were assembled to Blawnox, Pa.
> > > Make a good story someday to summarize all this.
> > >
> > > Bob D mentioned outsourcing to Central America.  One of the
> > > Airlines was Jet Blue.
> > >
> > > Harold Geissenheimer
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: John Swindler <j_swindler at hotmail.com>
> > > To: transitmgr2 at earthlink.net <transitmgr2 at earthlink.net>
> > > Date: Monday, January 24, 2005 10:57 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> > >
> > > >
> > > >Hi Harold
> > > >
> > > >Just for the record, Harold, I don't have a problem with CAF and
> >Elmira.
> > > >Actually, I'm harrassing Jim Holland a bit, who I've known for over 40
> > > >years.  However, Jim's mired in the PCC era.  I keep trying to nudge
> >him a
> > > >bit towards LRV operations, so far without much success.
> > > >
> > > >The PCC was a good design, and it is what I grew up with in Pittsburgh.
> >  I
> > > >have many fond memories, and am just a bit too young to remember the
> > > 'yellow
> > > >cars.'  But PCC was still a vehicle designed to last 20 years, and then
> >be
> > > >replaced with the next generation rolling stock.  That's a paraphase
> >from a
> > > >speech given by Dr. Hirschfeld of ERPCC to the AERA (today's APTA)
> > > >convention in 1935.
> > > >
> > > >My opinions go back to a trip to Holland in 1968.  Spent a day in The
> >Hague
> > > >and enjoyed the fast PCC operation on reserved rights of way.  Spent a
> >day
> > > >in Amsterdam and was not impressed with slow operation of Duewag cars
> >on
> > > >city streets.  Then spent a final day in Rotterdam with fast Duewag
> > > >operation on reserved rights of way.  The conclusions of a 24 year old
> > > >American???  Try to avoid letting the rail vehicle get bogged down in
> >city
> > > >traffic, and Duewag cars can give a better operator to passenger
> > > >productivity ratio.  And as for ride quality - not much difference.
> >PCC
> > > and
> > > >LRV can both provide comfortable, quick ride for passengers.  And I
> >like
> > > the
> > > >Duewag rides in San Diego, St. Louis, Denver, Sacramento, and even
> > > >Pittsburgh.  (but the door operation is very slow)
> > > >
> > > >My regret?  Not making a lot more trips to Europe over the years.
> > > >
> > > >John
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>From: "Harold G." <transitmgr2 at earthlink.net>
> > > >>Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> > > >>To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> > > >>Subject: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> > > >>Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2005 13:44:43 -0500
> > > >>
> > > >>Greetings to all.   Was Elmira the rehaber of the
> > > >>Arden PCC cars?   Pretty good work.
> > > >>
> > > >>Why all this criticism of CAF and Elmira?
> > > >>
> > > >>I liked the CAF cars for Sacramento.  Also
> > > >>the Ring line cars for Amsterdam.
> > > >>
> > > >>Harold Geissenheimer
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>-----Original Message-----
> > > >>From: John Swindler <j_swindler at hotmail.com>
> > > >>To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> ><pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> > > >>Date: Monday, January 24, 2005 9:47 AM
> > > >>Subject: [PRCo] Re: FYI about PAT CAF cars
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >>James B. Holland asked:
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>CAF  --  That's  CAlifornia, F-Line, San Francisco.......
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>              Keerect??
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >try:
> > > >> >
> > > >> >http://www.caf.es/10/instalaciones.asp
> > > >> >
> > > >> >and it's practically in your back yard, Jim
> > > >> >
> > > >> >Looks like CAF also acquired the former Adtranz plant in Elmira.
> >And we
> > > >>all
> > > >> >know what got fixed up at this plant.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >John
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>John Swindler wrote:
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> > CAF also has a plant in Sacramento. Suspect that there is more
> >to
> > > >>this
> > > >> >> > saga that hasn't come out yet.
> > > >> >> >
> > > >> >> >
> > > >> >> >> From: "Boris Cefer" <westinghouse at iol.cz>
> > > >> >> >> Reply-To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> > > >> >> >> To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
> > > >> >> >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: [Fwd: FYI about PAT CAF cars]
> > > >> >> >> Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:39:37 +0100
> > > >> >> >>
> > > >> >> >> Any guess what the cost of the trip to Spain and back is?
> > > >> >> >
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >