[PRCo] Re: Drum__Brakes_--_All-Electrics,__etc........

[Ken & Tracie]

A motor lead was left off by a mechanic...sounds like human error. So where 
did the rumor start that all unrebuilt 1700s were retired sooner than 
originally planned due to 1727's brake failure?

K.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Fred Schneider" <fwschneider at comcast.net>
To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 11:33 AM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Drum__Brakes_--_All-Electrics,__etc........


> Motor leads disconnected.   A motor was replaced the day before and a
> lead was not properly connected.   When any one motor is removed from
> the circuit, dynamics do not work because you do not have a complete
> brake loop.   It was a new operator.   He came all the way in sliding
> through stops using just the shaft brakes and track brakes.   But he
> got out of control in the tunnel.   He was new, inadequately trained
> and didn't realize that was wrong.
>
> There was a similar incident about the same time in Philadelphia.   A
> SEPTA motorman had a bad motor.  He cut out one of the motor pairs
> and then ran the car in violation of SEPTA rules that street
> operators are forbidden to run with motors cut out.   When he got to
> the loop at 42nd and Baltimore he found he wasn't able to stop the
> car ... he rolled it on it's side.   I think it was an air-car.    I
> saw another motorman that evening and asked what would happen to
> him.   That was during Joe Boscia's tenure at SEPTA.  Joe ran with an
> iron fist.   The rules said you don't do something and if you violate
> them you're out the door.   And that's what happened.   Joe
> eventually came up against politics and left SEPTA and is now with
> New Jersey Transit.   I saw Joe at the East Penn Traction Club meet
> in Villanova two weeks ago ... still very much a railfan and I think
> he's still with NJT.
>
> On May 27, 2007, at 11:24 AM, Ken & Tracie wrote:
>
>> Form Herb:
>>
>> Were the air cars so poorly maintained or so deteriorated
>> mechanically that
>> you made it a point to change out for a 1700 whenever you had the
>> "over the
>> hill" run?
>>
>> For anybody who recalls the 1727 runaway accident:
>>
>> What caused the brakes to fail on 1727 when it ran away and
>> derailed? That
>> made the paper way out here in Las Vegas.
>>
>> No broken air lines on that car... ;-)
>>
>> K.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Herb Brannon" <hrbran at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 7:28 AM
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Drum__Brakes_--_All-Electrics,__etc........
>>
>>
>>> When mechanical 'things' (in this case a 1945 PCC streetcar, still
>>> operating in 1975-76) get to a certain age, like humans, they
>>> start to
>>> fall apart. Yes, it was the "Spirit of '76" car, and it had a bad air
>>> leak. It would not have mattered if it would have had every type
>>> of air
>>> applied brake known to mankind, it still would not have stopped
>>> without
>>> any air pressure to apply the brakes. That brake system (air
>>> applied/spring release), in my opinion, was one of the more stupid
>>> systems
>>> devised. Couldn't at least one of the scores of engineers working
>>> on the
>>> PCC project thought far enough to realize that a spring applied/air
>>> released system would have been safer ???? They thought enought to
>>> put a
>>> 'hand brake' on the car, why not a "fail safe" braking system?
>>> Boris Cefer <westinghouse at iol.cz> wrote:  Are you sure, Herb? 1776
>>> was
>>> formerly an interurban car with B-3 trucks and
>>> spring-applied drum brakes with air actuators (pressure-releasing).
>>>
>>> B
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Rise Up -- Go Cavs
>>>  Herb Brannon
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>