[PRCo] Re: Gas Prices

[Phillip Clark Campbell]

Mr.Schneider;


My chain is now adjusted;  thank you!

Interesting how the same word has opposite
or nearly opposite meanings in two different
locations.

Still, what Mr.Lybarger says makes
sense - value of the service offered which is
subjective not objective and not universal..
Some are not as able as others to struggle
with a variety of suitcases, bags, packages
and thus use services to ease the burden;
therein lies the value.



Phil





----- Original Message ----
> From: Schneider Fred <fwschneider at comcast.net>
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 12:02:56 PM
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Gas Prices
> 
> Ah but Phillip, you are mixing American and English in the same  
> sentence, aren't you????   Hee Hee Hee.
> You are in London talking about value in transportation.   Then you  
> used the word cheap saying it implies inferior.
> 
> I hope you understanding that I having a wonderful time yanking your  
> chain.
> 
> In American, cheap means inferior.   But in English, cheap means  
> frugal.   A one day economy round trip ticket on British Railways is  
> called a "cheap day return."   In Britain cheap is good.   There is  
> nothing wrong with looking for cheap.   There is value in cheap if  
> you are British.   Sometimes cheap is really cheap.   I once asked  
> for two singles to from Stratford upon Avon to Canterbury and the  
> booking clerk sold me two cheap day returns.   When I questioned if  
> he was hard of hearing, he instructed me to throw away the returns.    
> The cheap day return cost less than the singles because they were  
> trying to promote travel at the time and he was just being nice to a  
> foreigner.
> 
> Remember that we are "two nations divided by a common language."
> 
> By the way, there are a variety of ways to get to the various London  
> airports.
> 
> There are taxis for those who have more money than brains or who wish  
> to show us how much they had before they spent it.   They are  
> probably popular with the Americans and with Brits who don't want to  
> associate with the masses.
> 
> London Heathrow (LHR) has two rail options, the tube and the national  
> railroad network.   I found the national network preferable before  
> 9-11 for outbound flights because you could check your luggage at  
> Paddington station in London and never see the cursed bags again  
> until you landed in Philadelphia.   To me that was value.   But if  
> you are traveling light, cheap is the Picadilly line underground  
> trains.   The one way cash fare is �4.00 ($5.79)  ... if you have  
> bought an oyster card, then the fare is �3.50 rush hours or �2.22 off  
> peak for zones 1 through 6.   The train from Padding is more than  
> four to eight times more expensive  �16.50 coach or �32.00 snob  
> class, double that for a return ticket.   The Heathrow Hotel Hoppa  
> bus is only �4 if you want a real bargin.   That's cheap.   It goes  
> to whatever hotels he has passenger he needs to set down.
> 
> London Gatwick (LGW) also has bus, train and cab options.    
> Interestingly there are two train options.   They will try to sell  
> you the Gatwick Express Train to London at �16.50 to �24.50 on way  
> and substantially more for a return ticket.   But guess what, all the  
> region south Brighton locals also stop at Gatwick Airport.   They may  
> take a little longer to get into Victoria Station, London, but  
> they'll get you there for probably half or perhaps a third what the  
> airport trains cost.   I cannot find how much because British Rail's  
> website blocks inquiries for domestic fares from outside of England  
> and if I go to Rail USA they will always add a healthy commission to  
> the ticket price.   The only way to find out the true fare is to walk  
> up to the window and buy the ticket ... you ask the booking clerk  
> (clark) what all your options are and don't forget to mention your  
> age if you are a pensioner.   If you are riding enough, it may pay to  
> buy a pension ID card.
> 
> Those European railroad passes that you buy in North American are  
> sold to encourage travel by foreigners.   They are no real bargin  
> (not cheap) unless you plan to ride constantly.   I had a buddy (now  
> deceased like so many of my old friends) who used to go to Europe  
> every year and travel on a Eurail pass.   For him it was a bargin  
> because he rode trains from breakfast to dinner every day for three  
> weeks.   He made money off them.   But if you want to see cathedrals,  
> manor homes, ride trolleys, look a museums ... then they make money  
> on the idiot who buys their railroad pass.   A lot of money.   If  
> you're going to England to see London, the tramway museum at Crich,  
> the new trams in Birmingham and Sheffield and Nottingham and you're  
> going to be there for a week ... pay the cash fares.    You'll  
> probably get a couple of free night's worth of hotel rooms with the  
> difference.
> 
> If you are going to Europe, best way is to find a friend over there  
> and get him to price your shopping list of tickets first.   While you  
> can buy single tickets here in the states, they are always  
> outrageously priced.   In the old days, you never even bought East  
> German tickets in West Germany ... you bought them in the eastern  
> stations because it was presumed you were one of them if you bought  
> them there and the prices were half as much as buying them  
> elsewhere..   That actually carried over into the early year of  
> unification.
> 
> 
> On Dec 29, 2008, at 2:00 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:
> 
> > Mr.Lybarger;
> >
> >
> > I remember reading a similar discussion here about travel
> > from the airport to London proper.  It is not 'wrong'
> > to look for the most inexpensive method as was noted;
> > you looked at the 'value' provided and didn't mind a
> > higher price.  A profound statement that has stuck
> > with me.  Mr.Swindler noted from the beginning that
> > limitation on travel dates dictated the 'ticket price'
> > for Mr.Craig didn't it.
> >
> > It is not so much that we look for 'cheap' that has
> > gotten us and a tremendous amount of the world
> > in trouble today as it is 'get something for nothing;'
> > that attitude is what strongly contributed to the
> > current crisis.  The old adage:
> > 'if it sounds too good to be true, then it isn't'
> > was ignored.  People wanted a house
> > and accepted mortgages with ever increasing
> > costs;  much of this was known up front wasn't it.
> >
> > People with stellar educations offered these
> > shady mortgages;  transit systems participated
> > in 'creative' financing which is very if not super
> > short-term planning;  other entities have done
> > similarly.  This may have 'started' at the top
> > and their 'leadership' was copied by the masses.
> >
> > I personally have an aversion to the word 'cheap'
> > as it implies inferior;  not everything inexpensive
> > is inferior.  Paying exorbitant prices doesn't
> > necessarily guarantee quality does it.
> >
> >
> > Phil
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> >> From: Edward H. Lybarger 
> >> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
> >> Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 8:19:45 AM
> >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Gas Prices
> >>
> >> But you have to travel when you have to travel.  We are going to  
> >> take a week
> >> after an April convention in Dallas and go to LA to see my  
> >> relatives, then
> >> go to the Grand Canyon and come home out of Las Vegas...and the  
> >> quote for
> >> the best flights comes to something a hair north of $700.  
> >> Reason?  The
> >> return is the day before Easter, and the airlines can get it.  
> >> Yes, I can do
> >> it for less on other airlines, but with additional stops and later  
> >> arrival
> >> times, and if it were just me, I might do that and add it to the  
> >> log, but
> >> Janis has other priorities than the number of airplanes I ride.  
> >> And if Beth
> >> & Co. come along, we have to coordinate the arrival and departure  
> >> times
> >> to/from two different cities.
> >>
> >> It's not just about money.  Wanting everything cheap is part of  
> >> what got us
> >> into the economic pickle we're in right now.
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
> >> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf  
> >> Of John
> >> Swindler
> >> Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:38 AM
> >> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org; Bruce Bente; Al Schneider;  
> >> Philip
> >> Craig
> >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Gas Prices
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I'm disappointed in you, Fred, for quoting a $854 price for round  
> >> trip to
> >> west coast.  Trying to scare people away from traveling so you can  
> >> get a
> >> better rate?
> >> Phil's problem was that a specific holiday and specific travel  
> >> days got in
> >> the way of finding a good price.  (and these are nice problems to  
> >> have,
> >> particularly given Phil's current employment situation - plus  
> >> visiting
> >> family)  Delta has a $187.99 price for round trip to San Diego  
> >> with 14-day
> >> advance purchase from White Plains airport.   Change in Detroit  
> >> outbound and
> >> change in Atlanta inbound.  And it is a real airplane west of the
> >> Mississippi.  The quote is from Travelocity.
> >>
> >> For a real airport, probably looking at around $300 round trip.
> >>
> >> And as for driving, I'd like to sleep in a comfortable room a few  
> >> times and
> >> have a few meals while heading west.  That has to be factored in.  
> >> And my
> >> car would be due another oil change upon return.  Don't forget  
> >> that cost,
> >> because maintenance is factored into the airline ticket price.  
> >> And I don't
> >> think the airlines get their planes for free - yet.
> >>
> >> We were in New York over the weekend, and paid $1.45 per gallon  
> >> for gas in
> >> New Jersey. The traffic was incredible until we got to  
> >> Pennsylvania.  Enjoy
> >> these gas prices while they last, because these rates are not good  
> >> news for
> >> those who advocate alternate energy sources.  I would not be  
> >> surprised if
> >> government policy will try to raise energy costs during 2009.  
> >> Make us feel
> >> more pain in the wallet.
> >>
> >> And how about those Steelers?  Great games yesterday to sort out the
> >> playoffs.  Pittsburgh probably has the best backup quarterback in  
> >> the NFL.
> >> Scored 24 unanswered points after Ben suffered his concussion.  
> >> There are
> >> some very good 'wild card' teams this year.  (just to struggle for  
> >> at least
> >> a Pittsburgh connection)
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >> John
> >>
> >>
> >>> To: bbente at bellsouth.net; pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org;
> >>> alschneider2 at juno.com; philgcraig204 at yahoo.com> From:
> >>> fwschneider at comcast..net> Subject: [PRCo] Gas Prices> Date: Sun,  
> >>> 28 Dec
> >>> 2008 13:40:45 -0500> > Now I'm really getting scared by this
> >>> "recession."> > Gasoline in Lancaster is now down to $1.54, the  
> >>> lowest
> >>> price, > adjusted for inflation by any means (including the CPI)  
> >>> in my
> >>>> lifetime or even my father's lifetime. If we were to adjust the 8 >
> >>> gallons for a dollar from the middle of the Depression, today's  
> >>> price
> >>>> is still almost 25% under that once adjusted to the Consumer  
> >>>> Price >
> >>> Index. If adjusted to wholesale prices, the drop since the 1930s  
> >>> is >
> >>> far greater.> > Phil Craig was telling me that the best price he  
> >>> could
> >>> find to visit > his daughter from Newark airport to San Diego for
> >>> Hanukkah holiday > was $854. I figure the cost of gasoline for a  
> >>> round
> >>> trip to the > west coast is now an unprecedented low of $300.