[PRCo] Re: Ancient trolley cars

[Fred Schneider]

You're right Phil.  I had lost track of the rebuilding of those flat  
front 1600s.   So when did PAT decide that they had enough 1700s to  
meet requirements.   I would have thought it was the same time that  
Carrick quit but I find that became full-time via tunnel on March 30,  
1968 and was then abandoned November 13, 1971.   Beltzhoover quit the  
same time.  By that time all that is left is 35, 36, 37, 42/38 and 43  
(if indeed there are still 43 trippers).  And PAT had about left 70  
Westinghouse 1700s more or less.

But you are right about the 1600s still running.   I photographed  
some in a snow storm in 1972 on Smithfield Street.   I remember 1603  
was one of them.

So when did they quit?

John Swindler:   tell us how many cars PAT needed to protect how many  
scheduled.

fws

On Jul 25, 2008, at 3:13 PM, Phillip Clark Campbell wrote:

> ----- Original Message ----
>
>> From: Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net>
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
>> Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 10:17:42 AM
>> Subject: [PRCo] Ancient trolley cars
>>
>>
>> Now the 1600s.   Seems to be that they were out of service about
>> 1972?   Correct?   That is about 27 years?   Aside from the 1700,
>> they lasted longer than any other Pittsburgh PCC cars.
>
> Wrong Mr.Schneider.  1972 is the date of the 'General Overhaul' (to  
> use a term) of trolleys by pat in Pittsburgh isn't it.  This is  
> when 1730 made its debut as Sunburst car.  Subsequently a number of  
> 1601s were overhauled and renumbered 1776 (ex-1616) and higher  
> because of equipment shortage weren't they.  Not taking time to  
> look for 'official' last day of 1601s but it is into the 1980's  
> isn't it, maybe a few into the 1990s.
>>
>> Rich: What month did 9000 go into public service in Philadelphia in
>> 1980?   Has it passed the 28 year mark yet?   Is it in service?
>> When did the last car go into service?
>>
>> One thing is certain, it is older than any PCC that ever ran on the
>> streets in Washington, Baltimore, Dallas, Los Angeles, Detroit,
>> Montreal, Chicago, Vancouver, Minneapolis, St.Louis, San Diego,
>> Birmingham, Cincinnati, Kansas City.
>>
> And?  The attitude of the 1940s and forward was hatred toward  
> streetcars as obsolete antiques wasn't it so they were abandoned  
> even shortly after going into service - Minneapolis and Detroit  
> come to mind don't they; Chicago converted the cars to Els.  The  
> PCCs didn't stand a chance of 'turning gray' in such an atmosphere  
> did they.  It was politics of some sort which killed off the  
> streetcars.
>
> Even today, and even in Kawasaki town, Septa has a distinct dislike  
> for rail and has made many different attempts at abandoning surface  
> rail.  Rail was a fad which took off nation wide in the 1970s;   
> 'now'  it is more of a necessity.
>
>
> Phil
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