[PRCo] Re: Pa Trolley Museum on KDKA

Sun Aug 23 16:09:11 EDT 2009

Yes, I believe that this information, compiled by Dave Hamley and Rick
Hannegan from PRC records, was made available to the list by me
initially...I think I sent Jim Holland a copy and he distributed it.

But what I'm really saying is that while I know what the records say,
there's often more to the story.  The photo of 3807 inside Homewood about
1941, covered with dust and sitting on shop trucks, adds a dimension that no
roster can.  But it doesn't tell us why it was there, just that it sat
occupying space for many years. 

-----Original Message-----
From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
[mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of Phillip
Clark Campbell
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 3:09 PM
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Pa Trolley Museum on KDKA

Mr.Lybarger;

Information I have indicates that 3807 was the first 38 to be scrapped at
Ingram on Feb-26-1948;  3803 was the second a year later on 3-01-1949, about
20-year service life.  The information does not state how long any car sits
idle before scrapping.

The listing does include some scrappings resulting from collisions or fire;
here are some notable ones:

3702 and 3709 collided at Walther's causing a fire which apparently badly
damaged both cars;  01-18-43 is the scrapping date for both.  I do not know
the date of the collision.  Is this the incident where sanding broke signal
contact giving the opposing car a green board?  Walther stop seems much
closer to Brookside than Cremona siding;  thus I assume the northbound car
used sand allowing the southbound car to enter the single track at
Brookside.

3706 is listed as destroyed by fire without specific circumstances; scrapped
03-18-32.

3763 was destroyed by a fire at Tunnel on 03-27-42;  again, specifics not
given.  She was scrapped by 'burning' whatever was left at Ingram on
04-15-42.

All the 3600s were scrapped by burning at Castle Shannon except
3601 and 3607 at West Park and 3615 at Homewood, 05-11-25, the first 36
scrapping.  3619 followed on 12-14-25,
3611--3613 on 07-31-26 with 3616--3618 following on 08-02-26 and
3604 on 08-12-26.    3607 scrapped 05-05-27;  all the rest in 1928.

4210 was in a collision in Castle Shannon and was apparently scrapped there
08-01-44.  Notes also indicate she was converted for One-man operation
10-29-34.  4200--4222 were so converted  (DE / OM)  except 4201 and 4202;
4234, 4239, 4245, 4248 are the other cars so converted.

4236 is the car that 'ran-away' in the tunnel killing 21, injuring 80, on
12-24-17;  she was scrapped on 01-11-40.

4318 caught fire 'on the road' and was scrapped 03-20-42.

4328 was damaged by a locomotive on 02-05-46; scrapped on 01-24-45,  almost
1-year later.

Orphan 4344 scrapped at Schoenville 06-06-52; never left the line.

4355 was badly damaged in a Washington collision 11-03-51; scrapped
04-03-52.  'Recent'  relative to PRC history; any other information
available?

4356 was damaged by fire at Tylerdale 11-03-51;  scrapped 12-03-52.

4364 badly damaged in collision with 1410 Forest Hills, Ardmore Blvd.
08-15-44;  scrapped 01-28-46.  1410 scrapped 08-16-66.

4390 destroyed in collision on charter 05-19-52;  scrapped 10-23-52.

5077 destroyed by derailment Liberty Ave Hill  (City Brewery involved;)
scrapped 01-02-31.

5154 destroyed by fire 12-07-46 but not scrapped until 03-09-50.

1242 in collision with M283 Dawn Jct. 1960;  scrapped 09-09-63.

1267 collides with 1400, Smithfield bridge 11-26-62.

1297 and 1299 involved in collisions on Ohio at Federal and Brighton
respectively.

1629 collides with 1296;  1629 scrapped at Rankin 08-13-59 while
1296 lived out service life and scrapped 10-07-63.

Interesting:
===========

4200 purchased 04-03-14;  leased to Beaver 12-01-15, returned to PRC 5-17
(assume that is May-1917;)  convert to DE-OM 07-26-33; scrapped 04-30-53.
Interesting career.

4380 was 4400 until renumbering 09-20-26.

4389 had HL-29a control

In July, August, and Oct of 1925 the following cars were shipped to Butler
in this order:
4372,  4382,  4355,  4357,  4375,  4376,  4371,  4354,  4350, 4385,  4383,
4384,  4352,  4351

4405 converted to Instruction car with K-35 control one end,  HL the other.
Other notes indicate a K43c controller, straight air valve 'at the front
end;'  WH514PR motors.

3756 moved to the museum under its own power on 02-07-54; it is listed as
'sold to PERC' on 02-11-54.

 Phil
Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'

________________________________
From: Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:58:22 AM
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Pa Trolley Museum on KDKA

3807 was painted at least once and perhaps twice (I don't have the paint
book in front of me).  There is a photo of it in storage inside Homewood
showing mid-'30s advertising in the windows.  It ran.

What I'd like to know is why it quit running, and when.

-----Original Message-----
From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
[mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of Phillip
Clark Campbell
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 7:16 PM
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Subject: [PRCo] Re: Pa Trolley Museum on KDKA

From: bill937ca <bill937ca at yahoo.ca>
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 1:20:56 PM
Subject: [PRCo] Fwd:  Re: Pa Trolley Museum on KDKA

> --- In LRPPro at yahoogroups.com,
> Edson Tennyson <etennyson at ...> wrote:

> IT  WAS  NOT  THE  BEST  IN  1925.:
>  In that KDKA  report they stated that the now old orange low fioor
> 3756 car was the BEST of the art in 1925 for service on the Charleroi 
> and Washington lines.
> ...they were lousy for that service,

This is very well known, isn't it.  It has been well documented before.
Isn't it presumed that the 3800s were ordered because of the failure of the
3750s?

>  By 1928, they had been replaced by the 3800 series...
> interurbans which were also lemons of a different flavor.
> One car was so bad it never ran

Didn't I see comments in the archives that this is false?
Wouldn't the car cards refute this?

> As a commuter on the Charleroi line 1947 to 1949,...

Mr.Tennyson will also tell you there were three sidings on Overbrook in this
time period when in fact there were only
two:  Bon Air and Smith.  This did make for 3 single track sections though
didn't it.  The sidings at McKinley Park and Edgebrook were added upon
abandonment of Charleroi and Washington.

Like most of the rest of us Mr.Tennyson is aging which 'may' affect the
memory on many items.  Nevertheless, his experience with PRC is enviable.

> E d  T  e n n y s o n

Phil
Without  a   'coast'   but  not  a   'cause.'

> On Aug 19, 2009, at 11:26 PM, John Swindler wrote:
> Pennsylvania trolley museum made KDKA news - On link below, click on 
> horsecar for video.
> Dial up might have problems with video due to possible file size.
>
> John
>
> Subject: KDKA
> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2009 22:56:43 -0400
>
> http://kdka.com/kdcountry/Pennsylvania.trolley.museum.2.1129569.html