[PRCo] Re: Streetcars in the Strip District?

[Fred Schneider]

Please reread your emails from earlier today.   I explained it all in detail this morning.   FWS


On Aug 30, 2011, at 6:51 PM, Herb Brannon wrote:

> Then what was 20-REBECCA which is shown on the PTM track map?
> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 18:47, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net>wrote:
> 
>> Point of order ... you are correct for your era Dwight but it went by
>> several names.
>> 
>> Route:   112A Rebecca Street Shuttle (on the route cards)
>> Destination:   REBECCA STREET SHUTTLE
>> Destination:   17 REEDSDALE
>> 
>> Rebecca and Reedsdale streets are equivalent ... different years, different
>> names.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Aug 30, 2011, at 4:51 PM, Dwight Long wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> Fred
>>> 
>>> 17 was NOT Rebecca.  Rebecca was 20, and was not a shuttle.  17 was
>>> Reedsdale and was a shuttle.  Both came off in 1951. I rode both, might
>> have
>>> been in the last month, but alas, took no pictures of either.  Tracks and
>>> overhead for at least 20 were in for years after bustitution.  Maybe PRC
>> had
>>> visions of restoring to trams some day?  Reason given for abandonment was
>>> construction in the lower Point area (Gateway Center) and supposed
>> removal
>>> of the "temporary" wooden ramp to the Manchester Bridge.  Said ramp was
>>> still there many years later!  17 perished  because PRC was in the
>> process
>>> of getting rid of all shuttles and it was convenient to do so at the time
>> 20
>>> was bustituted, simply, I think, by routing the bus over its route.
>>> 
>>> Shadeland was gone before my time. I have no clue.
>>> 
>>> Dwight
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Fred Schneider" <fwschneider at comcast.net>
>>> To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 12:06 PM
>>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Streetcars in the Strip District?
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> As Fonzi would have said,  Correctimundo.   Some shuttles such as 78
>>>> Laketon Road carried the number of the longer route 78 Oakmont simply
>>>> because, when it was shortened, that was practical.   And the 9 Charles
>>>> shuttle took the number of the shortened version of the Perrysville
>>>> car ---- 9 Perrysville to Charles Street and Perrysville Avenue once
>>>> double end cars were removed from Perrysville Avenue in the 1920s.
>>>> 
>>>> In some cases the shuttles were remnants of longer lines that once ran
>>>> downtown such as 29 Thornburg.
>>>> 
>>>> But you are absolutely correct John.   The shuttles often took the
>> numbers
>>>> of previously abandoned lines in the 'hood.
>>>> 
>>>> Now explain to be how 16 Superior - Shadeland and 17 Rebecca Street got
>>>> their numbers.   There had to be exceptions to the belief that all
>>>> shuttles got numbers from abandoned routes.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Aug 30, 2011, at 11:45 AM, John Swindler wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> It appears that route numbers were assigned in 1914 to routes operating
>>>>> downtown, E Liberty and Oakland - places were there were multiple
>> routes.
>>>>> There was no need to assign a route number to the various shuttle
>> routes.
>>>>> That came later as route numbers were "freed" thru what we would now
>> call
>>>>> "rationalization" of the PRC system.  One of my retirement hobbies will
>>>>> be to see what the Pittsburgh newspapers have to say about these early
>>>>> routes.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cheers
>>>>> John
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> From: dwightlong at verizon.net
>>>>>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>>>>>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Streetcars in the Strip District?
>>>>>> Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 11:25:02 -0400
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> John
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Yes, in anything resembling our time they certainly were. 51 was the
>> Bon
>>>>>> Air Shuttle, 52 was the Carson Street shuttle (from the end of line
>> loop
>>>>>> upriver), and 53 was, of course, Carrick.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I knew Derrick could not have meant 51--at least in the parlance that
>>>>>> any PRC enthusiast living today would remember!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Dwight
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: John Swindler
>>>>>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, 30 August, 2011 08:19
>>>>>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Streetcars in the Strip District?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 53 used the Tenth St. bridge and Second Ave. to downtown. 50 used
>> Carson
>>>>>> St. and Smithfield St. bridge. Both were on Carson 10th to 18th St.
>> Then
>>>>>> 53 went up 18th to Brownsville Rd., while 50 continued on Carson to
>> 30th
>>>>>> St.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In early years there were two routes that used Tenth St. bridge and
>> two
>>>>>> routes on Carson that used Smithfield St. I think Tenth St. bridge had
>> a
>>>>>> short turn at 22nd and Carson. Routes numbers 50, 51. 52 and 53 were
>>>>>> originally used on these Carson St. routes. But some of the numbers
>> were
>>>>>> shifted around over the years.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The shuttle to 36th St. was the remnant of the line from Carson to
>> Hays
>>>>>> on south side of Mon River. There was a Pittsburgh & Birmingham/PRC
>>>>>> carbarn at Carson and 30th St., which might have had something to do
>>>>>> with 30th being terminal of route 50 Carson.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> just trying to keep current (lol)
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>> John
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 19:04:43 -0400
>>>>>>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Streetcars in the Strip District?
>>>>>>> From: shadow at gmail.com
>>>>>>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 6:55 PM, Dwight Long <dwightlong at verizon.net
>>> 
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Derrick
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Please explain how Rt. 50 diverged from Rt 51, or even vice versa!
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> sorry, should have said 53, not 51!
>>>>>>> i have bus on the brain.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Derrick
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Herb Brannon
> In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> 
> 
>