[PRCo] Re: PATransit East Busway

[Dwight Long]

Fred

Ardmore—I was there in December 1966 and the trackway had already been paved over for the buses, but the Brilliners were still running.  Last runs either later in December 1966 or very early 1967.

With respect to several of the other examples cited, there is a conflation of HOV lanes with busways.  They are not the same.  A busway is exactly what the name implies, a roadway for buses (only).  It is in essence a concrete railway.  The more sophisticated ones have guidance systems;  the less sophisticated are simply highways for buses.  The only advantage that I have ever seen claimed for them is that a bus can leave them and proceed to a destination in a location remote from the busway but too sparsely populated to warrant a railway (including tramway in that definition) and get there using city streets, thus providing the coveted one seat ride.  Whether the customers actually prefer a one seat ride all the way in a bus as opposed to one part way in a bus and the rest of the way in a rail vehicle I have never seen documented. Certainly well-designed transfer facilities between rail and feeder bus lines DO seem to work.

Dwight

From: John Swindler 
Sent: Saturday, 17 December, 2011 12:50
To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org 
Subject: [PRCo] Re: PATransit East Busway

 
 
What about the Providence tunnel??
 
And South Busway preceeded the East Busway.
 
There was also an El Monte busway, but memory is failing with that one.  Fred????
 
Also Harrisburg had a busway, but taxpayers didn't pay for it, and the merchants had it converted to parking 15-20 years ago.  This is another one needing clarification from  Fred.

 

> From: fwschneider at comcast.net
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: PATransit East Busway
> Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2011 21:42:29 -0500
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
> 
> Herb:
> Pittsburgh's East Busway was far from the first......
> 
> The earliest that I can think of was probably the conversion of the Philadelphia Suburban Transportation Company's line from Llanerch to Ardmore to a reserved bus highway. When? Perhaps sometime in 1967. Does it work? It is still exclusively a SEPTA facility but that route, since it's conversion, has become one of SEPTA's least popular services. Off peak weekdays is hourly. Rush hour frequencies ... 15 to 30 minutes. It uses the smallest vehicles in SEPTA's fleet. You will probably find more people bicycles and skateboards on the busway than actual buses. 
> 
> http://www.septa.org/schedules/bus/pdf/103.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> Shirley Busway (Shirley Highway) out of Arlington, Virginia was probably the first busway in 1969, 15 years before PAT East Busway. It simply became an HOV lane open to buses and high occupancy motor vehicles. It has been underutilized for years, probably because the Metrorail blue line also goes to Springfield and perhaps the riders feel the subway offers a more comfortable / dependable ride that a bus on the interstate. I saw a recent number of 7700 riders but it was a spot survey and I don't know if it was all day or just peak. The excerpt below from Wikipedia explains.... 
> 
> 
> HOV facility
> 
> Cars on I-395, leaving Washington, D.C.(in distance) and passing by the Pentagon inArlington, Virginia.
> I-395 contains a reversible, barrier-separated HOV facility, also known locally as the "express lanes", with its own entrances and exits, provided as a third roadway of Interstates 395 and 95 between South Eads Street near the Pentagon in Arlington County and State Route 234 in Prince William County, Virginia.[2] During rush hour, the HOV facility operates in the direction of rush-hour traffic and is restricted to vehicles containing three or more passengers. Motorcycles, alternative fuel cars, hybrids registered in Virginia before July 1, 2006, and federal law enforcement vehicles are also permitted to use HOV lanes, even if carrying only one occupant. At other times, the facility is either open to all traffic in one direction or closed to all traffic.[3]
> The facility was initially constructed with a single lane as the first busway in the United States before being expanded and converted to HOV use.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> El Monte Busway (Southern California Rapid Transit District) opened in 1974. I found a patronage number of 40,000 a day. That busway lane has also become a HOV lane. This is in the San Bernardino Freeway (Interstate 10). The Southern Pacific, now BNSF, is in the middle .... it is actually the old Pacific Electric line to San Bernardino. The freeway lanes flank the railroad with the busway (HOV) lanes closest to the railroad.
> 
> I wrote a issue of Headlights back in 1974 comparing light rail and busways. John Swindler will probably recall that it got us a lot of hate mail. One of the chaps who was most vocal actually owned several buses so I asked him why he was so upset. His response was that he wanted his trolleys and his buses kept separate and they should not be compared. :<) I recall making a statement in that article that the automobile clubs / concrete and highway lobbyists will probably be delighted with the busway concept because when it fails, they will get an extra freeway lane free. Well ... they got an extra lanes on both I-395 and I-10 for the taking. 
> 
> 
> On Dec 16, 2011, at 8:34 PM, Herb Brannon wrote:
> 
> > That's a good enough answer. I was discussing Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) with
> > a couple of my TTC friends. They came up with several BRT systems and the
> > average ridership but did not mention Pittsburgh's Busways. The East Busway
> > was one of the first in North America being opened in 1983 and I just
> > needed a very average figure to put along with my mention of the East
> > Busway. In fact I reduced the passenger count down to 24,000 weekday
> > riders. I'm sure the 30,000 figure was during the economic "good times" of
> > the 1990s.
> > If anyone wants to do the finite research then have at it. It would be
> > interesting to see what the figures are now.
> > 
> > On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 14:24, Derrick Brashear <shadow at gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> >> you found an answer which may have been correct for some point in
> >> time. there's no date there.
> >> 
> >> On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 1:22 PM, Herb Brannon <hrbran at cavtel.net> wrote:
> >>> Found the answer on the "Pittsburgh Highways" website:
> >>> This busway serves downtown Pittsburgh, East End, and the eastern suburbs
> >>> of Allegheny County. The average rider ship for routes using the busway
> >>> are 30,000 daily and 7.5 million a year. It is designed for speeds up
> >> to
> >>> 55 MPH, lower speed limits are applied in some twists in the valley.
> >>> 
> >>> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 17:09, Herb Brannon <hrbran at cavtel.net> wrote:
> >>> 
> >>>> There still has to be an "average" number of passengers carried each
> >>>> weekday on the East Busway on all routes. The average number of light
> >> rail
> >>>> passengers (from all rail routes) is over 24,000 per day. I just need to
> >>>> know the "KISS" rough average of all passengers carried on the East
> >> Busway.
> >>>> Where they come from makes no difference.
> >>>> 
> >>>> The PATransit website gives light rail and "total" bus (all routes
> >>>> systemwide) figures for each day but does not break down the difference
> >>>> between local bus, express, and Busway daily totals.
> >>>> 
> >>>> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 15:18, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> 
> >>>>> That would be difficult to ascertain because, unlike the Newark City
> >>>>> Subway today and more like the subway as original configured, the East
> >>>>> Busway is a funnel for many routes in the east end.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> Are you trying to find a number for simply the passengers who board at
> >>>>> stations along the busway, or board downtown and get off along the
> >> busway?
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> Or are you looking for a total of all riders on the routes that use the
> >>>>> busway, which would be much larger number? If you want everything
> >> using
> >>>>> the busway, you have to consider multiple agencies Herb. Westmoreland
> >>>>> County Transit Authority buses running into Pittsburgh also use the
> >> busway.
> >>>>> It is not limited to just PAT routes.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> On Dec 15, 2011, at 12:23 PM, Herb Brannon wrote:
> >>>>> 
> >>>>>> Does anyone know the average daily ridership on the East Busway?
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Herb Brannon
> >>>>>> In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> --
> >>>> Herb Brannon
> >>>> In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> >>>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> --
> >>> Herb Brannon
> >>> In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> --
> >> Derrick
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Herb Brannon
> > In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
>