[PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map

Fri Mar 25 10:34:25 EDT 2011

John

With respect to the BVT and SEL&BVT (Shown by an older name as "Ohio River Passenger Ry) connections, the map is generally useful but must be taken with the proverbial "grain of salt" if one is trying to track the tramway routes in their location when abandoned .  This is because of changes in the highways in the two plus decades between the time of these maps and the end of the tram lines, the fact that in some instances the tramways are shown as separated PRW when in fact they were in city streets, and in at least one instance, because the tramway line itself was relocated (at Smith's Ferry, where the deviation through Glasgow Boro was eliminated in favor of a straighter alignment on the north side of the C&P tracks.  The latter occurred in 1926;  the state highway (shown on the map as Rt. 243 but later and currently Pa. 68) was also rerouted out of Glasgow to the north side of the C&P.

All that said, these maps are a useful starting point for exploration. There are still a number of SEL&BVT artifacts to be found;  those from the BVT are much sparser.

Apropos of earlier, non-tram exchanges on this list concerning canalization of the Western Rivers, the Beaver County map is also useful for showing the location of the wicket dams which were the first attempt at canalizing the Ohio.  Dams on the map shown as #4,5 and 6 were all replaced about 1936 by the opening of the Montgomery Island Dam. The lockhouse for Dam 6 is still there and is a restaurant and sort of semi-museum--well worth a visit.

Not an electric railway matter, but one of interest to me, is that an "earth road" is shown between the end of the Beaver-Monaca P&LE bridge and a place called "Bellowsville,"  now known as Josephtown.  There is no road there now, but there is a branch of the P&LE (now CSX).  Apparently this branch was built on, or usurped, the grade of the "earth road."  This branch was built around 1930 to serve the zinc smelting plant of St. Joseph Lead Co. (which is still in existence and still functional, although under different ownership) and later served the DPC-built styrene-butadiene plant at Kobuta and the Shippingport nuclear power plant (first in the USA).

Dwight

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: John Swindler 
  To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org 
  Sent: Thursday, 24 March, 2011 21:04
  Subject: [PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map

  This might be of some help for Ellwood city to New Castle portion of Harmony route in Lawrence County.

  ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/pdf/BPR_PDF_FILES/Maps/Type_10_GHS_Historical_Scans/Lawrence_1930.pdf

  And this might be helpful for Harmony branch to Beaver Falls plus Beaver Valley Traction and connection to Steubenville.

  ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/pdf/BPR_PDF_FILES/Maps/Type_10_GHS_Historical_Scans/Beaver_1916.pdf

  Unfortunately Butler Co. not available on PennDOT website.

  > From: stephen at titchenal.com
  > To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
  > Subject: [PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map
  > Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2011 20:11:19 -0400
  > 
  > Thanks for the updates.
  > 
  > I mostly followed the Digital Elevation information and was starting to
  > figure out locations where there is nothing left on the ground. Once you
  > leave Pittsburgh, there seem to be very few maps showing the Interurban
  > lines through cities such as Ellwood City. I did the tracings last fall
  > before I purchased Wayne's books and forgot I never updated them. I'll get
  > back to them in the next week or two and share updated kmz files.
  > 
  > Not sure when I will make it to Pittsburgh again to explore in the field.
  > 
  > Stephen Titchenal
  > www.railsandtrails.com
  > www.titchenal.com
  > 
  > -----Original Message-----
  > From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
  > [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of Derrick
  > Brashear
  > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 1:15 PM
  > To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
  > Subject: [PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map
  > 
  > On Thu, Mar 24, 2011 at 12:55 PM, Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
  > wrote:
  > > What am I missing?  Which "map originally mentioned" are we talking about.
  > 
  > the one at the pghbridges site, not the attached kml files.
  > 
  > > The pink line on the Google Earth overlay is along the east shoulder of US
  > > 19 north of Warrendale.  The car line hugged the Turnpike alignment
  > briefly,
  > > then followed the road that today goes to the hotels, then went through
  > the
  > > toll booth location before bearing NE to the alignment that is correctly
  > > shown.
  > >
  > > Perhaps what I'm calling Warrendale is really Cranberry, which didn't
  > exist
  > > in HR days!
  > 
  > no, the kmz files do have the error you describe!
  > 
  > > -----Original Message-----
  > > From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
  > > [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of
  > Derrick
  > > Brashear
  > > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 12:16 PM
  > > To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
  > > Subject: [PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map
  > >
  > > On Thu, Mar 24, 2011 at 12:08 PM, Edward H. Lybarger <trams2 at comcast.net>
  > > wrote:
  > >> It's absolutely amazing how these come right up as a Google Maps overlay!
  > >> A couple of Harmony Route items jump out:  1) The Warrendale alignment
  > >> was to the west of the present-day Route 19, between it and the
  > >> Turnpike.  It's highly visible on the PennPilot photos.
  > >
  > > The map originally mentioned appears to get that right fwiw.
  > >
  > >>2) There are major errors in
  > >> Ellwood City.  The main line came straight through across the valley
  > >>on two  large bridges (Knox on the south and Grimm on the north) and
  > >>followed what  is today Joffre St. in the park.  My wife's family
  > >>reunions are held there  and the concrete is still highly visible, even
  > >>in July, if one knows where  to look.  There was a wye between the two
  > >>bridges, where the line went west  into town and beyond to Koppel and
  > >>Beaver Falls.  That latter portion of the  route is not shown.  It
  > >>started out by following Portersville Road, as you  show, but track did
  > >>not run on either Sims or Jefferson Streets. Map  attached below. 3) the
  > > street trackage in New Castle are incomplete.
  > >>
  > >> I'm not claiming to have reviewed everything here!  Just wanted to
  > >> clear up a couple points of confusion.
  > >>
  > >> Ed
  > >>
  > >> -----Original Message-----
  > >> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org
  > >> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementia.org] On Behalf Of
  > >> Stephen Titchenal
  > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2011 10:04 PM
  > >> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementia.org
  > >> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Butler Harmony Map
  > >>
  > >> Attached are two kmz files (for Google Earth or Google Maps) tracing
  > >> the routes based on digital elevation data showing the right of way if
  > >> still existent or using older maps and aerial photos if not. Tracing
  > >> should be accurate to within 5 or so feet. You can load the file into
  > >> a gps (or Google Earth on a gps enabled smart phone) and use it in the
  > >> field. I have not had a chance to explore this right-of-way in the
  > >> field yet, but other rights-of-ways I have explored in the field were
  > >> quite accurate.  If you find anything way off, let me know so I can
  > > correct it.
  > >> I am in the process of tracing the routes of abandoned railroads,
  > >> street cars and interurbans in Ohio and Western Pa using this technique.
  > >>
  > >> Stephen Titchenal
  > >> www.railsandtrails.com
  > >> www.titchenal.com
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
  > >> -- Type: application/vnd.google-earth.kmz
  > >> -- Size: 14k (15289 bytes)
  > >> -- URL :
  > >> http://lists.dementia.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/Harmony%20Route.km
  > >> z
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
  > >> -- Type: application/vnd.google-earth.kmz
  > >> -- Size: 10k (10330 bytes)
  > >> -- URL :
  > >> http://lists.dementia.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/Pittsburgh%20&%20B
  > >> utler%
  > >> 20Electric.kmz
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
  > >> -- Type: image/jpeg
  > >> -- Size: 775k (793775 bytes)
  > >> -- URL :
  > >> http://lists.dementia.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/Ellwood%20City%20M
  > >> ap%20EHL.jpg
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > > --
  > > Derrick
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > -- 
  > Derrick
  > 
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