[PRCo] Re: Generic Description

[Ray]

 Ok,= I must not be conveying my thoughts on this subject very well.First
offyou have to start somewhere, some time.
Second I never said  all 1000s of pictures had to be= scanned by tomorrow.
Ofcourse itwill take time. Doesn't everyt= hing.
Third,  I am saying it is possible (a= t least for me) to look at a
photograph and just appreciate it whether a ca= ption is written about it or
not?
Fourth, while = having this material available to the public may not be as
important as&nbs= p;displaying a streetcar or restoring a streetcar, it is
inmy o= pinion something that is needed andshould be part of the museums=
mission. 
Lets examine the definition of t= he word museum, an institution devoted to
the procurement, care, study, and= display of objects of lasting interest or
value; also : a place where obje= cts are exhibited.
How is lasting interest or va= lue maintained in a collection that nobody
cansee or is only available to = a select few? Again read the definition, 
the care and procurement cri= teria seem to be met, but the display and
exhibition requirements are lacki= ng. 
Ray
  On 05/20/11, Fred Schnei= der<fwschneider at comcast.net> wrote:Correct
Derrick. S= ame logic I employed with the local historical society when I do
field rese= arch. Now all you need are the guys to sit there for thousands
ofhours a= nd scan the bloody negatives or prints.



On May 20, 2= 011, at 6:35 PM, Derrick Brashear wrote:

>
>
&= gt; 
>On May 20, 2011, at 3:34 PM, Fred Schneider <fwsc= hneider at comcast.net[1]>
wrote:
>
>>1) The title = that includes company and car number is bad because you
might have, in a mu= seum such as ours, a hundred identical titles. 
>>
>&= gt; 2) That description: "West Penn. FT 3. Connellsville Shops.&quo= t;
is apparently what Frank put on the slide and it means nothing to the a=
verage person. If you come to the museum from Pocatello, Idaho, what does=
Connellsville shops mean? But a descriptor that reads "Company car = repair
facility in Connellsville, PA" might be understandable. And w= hat does that
FT 3 indicate. Be damned if I have a clue. 
>>>>A description should probably start with a file number or arc= hive
number. Next we probably need to figure out who the user is and what= he
wants. Does he want to find West Penn Railways? Or does he want to = find
trolleys from Uniontown, PA? Or might he be interested in trolleys f= rom
Fayette County, Pennsylvania? Or Southwestern Pennsylvania? All of = these
are possible descriptors that we might wish to use to help the user f= ind
something. Remember guys, we're looking at this as rail fanatics. T= he
ultimate user might not be one of us. He might simply be a transport h=
istorian or a historian in general 50 years from now. Incorporating the ca=
rnumber into the descriptor might be a minor thing for the user we will be=
serving. (I am a railway historian trying to think how someone else migh= t
want to use our files when we are not here. I can look at the declining=
number of hobbyists in groups like the NRHS or the ERA and understand that=
we won't be here.) 
>>
>>Countless hours? Aga= in, nothing is impossible for those who are not
doingit. If you have 2= 00,000 photos that need to be captioned and it takes
an average of 15 minut= es to do a caption, we are talking 24 man years. Is
that a safe number for= the collection. Might be. My own collection is close
to 50,000 prints = and I am simply extrapolating from the number of file
cases.
>>= I have not hauled the other file cases out to Washington yet. I might
add= that PTM also has my albums already and that might include another
5,000p= rints or six months worth of full time data entry. Did I hear anyone
volu= nteering? 
>>
>
>I'll poke a hole in your b= alloon and say the cart belongs before the
horse: once it's scanned it can = be captioned from anywhere in the world,
not just from Washington, PA. And = I'd work on it. obviously I wouldn't
knowall of it.
>
>T= he scanning is the only thing which requires uniquely being where the
origi= nal is. nothing else. so forcing other things to be done there is the
very = waste of time you decry.
>
>>And what about slides? = And what about the hundreds of thousands of
negatives that need to be catal= oged and scanned? 
>
>what about em? 
>
&gt= ;> I already gave them my negatives and the Frank Goldsmith collection
a= nd Bill Watts collection ... that's probably on the order of magnitude of
2= 0,000 negatives. Most of them were at identified which is more than I
can=say for a lot of the material that comes over the transom. 
>&gt= ; 
>>Ray, a simple description is fine. One that reads West P= enn 700-type car
on the Fairchance line believed to be near Hopwood about 1= 948 is OK until
you refine it. But it requires historians willing to writ= e such words as
"believed" or "unknown" or "suspe= cted" or "circa" or "about" when we do
notknow fo= r certain.
>>
>>Perhaps trolley near Hopwood, Fayet= te County, Pennsylvania circa 1948
might even be better for the future user= with the railfan details buried
farther down in the description. 
&= gt;> 
>>Regardless, what is written needs to be correct and = there are thousands
of pictures and slides which were never captioned. The= guys that volunteer
simply look at Ed and say what's this. Then he throw= s them in a pile and
waits for Fred to appear. There are still going to b= e a large number that
Idon't know. We need more resources. 
>= 
>No argument.
>
>>When I edited Headlights m= agazine 40 years ago and someone gave me a
picture that they couldn't ident= ify, I used it to fill space. It became a
Can you identify this? feature.= But we had national circulation. We usually
found out. Unfortunately= doing the same in Trolley Fare probably won't get
us the same following. = 
>>
>>fws
>>
>>
>&= gt; On May 20, 2011, at 1:26 PM, Lattner, Raymond wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>What's wrong with a generic description o= f a photograph?
>>>
>>>Taken from, Pittsburg= h History &Landmarks Foundation - Historic
Pittsburgh Image Collection= 
>>>
>>>Title: West Penn Railways 293
&g= t;>> Date: August 7, 1949
>>>Creator: Fairbanks Jr., F= rank B.
>>>Description: West Penn. FT 3. Connellsville Shops= .
>>>Subjects: Transportation--Pennsylvania--Pittsburgh,
>>>West Penn Railways.
>>>Identifier: 411-293-22= 
>>>Additional Information: Image Collection Homepage
&= gt;>> Rights: Copyright of the Frank B. Fairbanks Rail Transportation=
Archive.
>>>
>>>Lets Try to write our own sh= all we:
>>>
>>>
>>>Title: Pitt= sburgh Railways Company 1765
>>>Date: August 7, 1949? or unk= nown
>>>Creator: John Smith or from The PTM Collection
= >>>Description: Pittsburgh Railways Company. PCC 1765 On street. =
PossiblyForbes? Unknown.
>>>Subjects: Transportation--Penns= ylvania--Pittsburgh,
>>>Pittsburgh Railways Company
&gt= ;>> Identifier: 411-293-22
>>>Additional Information: = Image Collection Homepage
>>>Rights: Copyright of the PTM Ra= il Transportation Archive.
>>>
>>>The top one= is a description for the Frank B. Fairbanks Rail
Transportation Archive>>> photographs. Now, how many of you enjoyed looking
at those = pictures with a simple
>>>caption? I know I did.
>&g= t;> 
>>>I think people can still enjoy photographs with s= imple descriptions,
howabout you?
>>>
>>>>>>Also someone said we would have to "spend countless ho= urs writing it
down before turning someone loose
>>>scanning= ." Aren't countless hours spent restoring the trolleys, aren't
countle= ss hours spent on track and
>>>overhead maintenance, and so = on. With that attitude why have a museum
atall.
>>>
&= gt;>> 
>>>Ray
>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>= >
>
>





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