[PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit

[Derrick Brashear]

On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 8:57 PM, Stephen Titchenal
<stephen at titchenal.com> wrote:
> Thanks for the maps. The "route plan edgeworth - baden" seems to be the more
> geographically accurate of the two. I was able to georeference it and it
> pretty much followed the Duff Rd. routing.

incidentally, does that route plan continue north?

> I'm off to a Mapping conference so I won't be able to look into anything
> further for a couple of days.

which one?

>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of Edward
> H. Lybarger
> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 6:11 PM
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>
> Agreed!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of Dwight
> Long
> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 5:19 PM
> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>
>
> Ed
>
> The maps are completely consistent with what I have always understood was
> the routing of BVT and P&B through the area in question.  I think we can
> close this file!
>
> Dwight
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Edward H. Lybarger" <trams2 at comcast.net>
> To: <pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 12:56 PM
> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>
>
>>I managed to find time to grab scans of two maps, attached.
>> Also to download and print out PennPilot images.  On APQ-29-21 the
>> pollution
>> from the mill across the river is light enough that I can easily make out
>> the old alignment of the road south of Baden, but there's no evidence of a
>> car line.  I'm thinking the new highway was built along the car line,
>> rather
>> than the other way around, through this area.
>>
>> Ed
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of Edward
>> H. Lybarger
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 11:29 AM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> Would that have been the old road rather than a car line?  I wish I had
>> all
>> my resources handy!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of
>> Stephen
>> Titchenal
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 11:05 AM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> And the 1939 Aerial clearly shows a right-of-way along the same route as
>> the
>> 1908 topo - that is actually what I traced. There is not much sign of it
>> on
>> a current aerial or DEM.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of
>> Stephen
>> Titchenal
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 10:55 AM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> A more careful comparison of the 1916 Beaver County Map and the 1908
>> Selwickley topo south of Baden:
>> In 1908 only what seems to become Beaver Rd in Ambridge is shown with all
>> the convolusions I traced.
>> In 1916 the south of Baden the first jog west is still be there - near the
>> current State St/Ehman Ave to what is now labeled Legionville Rd.
>> (Legionville Rd appears to take a different route through that area -
>> there
>> was a spur from the PRR there as well) From there south the 1916 map shows
>
>> a
>> straight road and trolley line that appears to enter Ambridge at Duss Rd.
>> The "convoluted" Beaver Rd from the 1908 topo does not show. The trolley
>> line is east of that road until about the current Keystone Rd/Beaver Rd
>> intersection where is crosses to the west side and disappears at the
>> Ambridge town border.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of
>> Stephen
>> Titchenal
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 10:10 AM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> The convolutions south of Baden are based on the 1908 Sewickley topo and
>> 1916 Beaver County maps. I am not sure when State St/Duss Ave was
>> straighten
>> south of Baden. Is the "company map" the one in the Rohrbeck book? That
>> map
>> does not have a date or attribution. The map does not show the
>> convolutions
>> - perhaps because of a later routing?
>>
>> Do you have any details on the end of the line in Edgeworth?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of Edward
>> H. Lybarger
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 9:21 AM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Re: Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> Hi, Steve,
>>
>> I don't understand all the convolutions you're showing through Ambridge
>> and
>> Harmony Township.  The company maps clearly show a routing along Merchant,
>> 14th, and Duss Avenue all the way out.  Rohrbeck's book confuses a bit by
>> calling Duss Avenue "Beaver Road," but the car line was on Beaver Road
>> only
>> at the east end of town.  Likewise I don't get the zigzag at the west
>> (north) end of your map...the line was on the main street -- Duss Avenue
>> through Ambridge and Harmony Twp., State Street in Baden.  Beaver Road
>> dead-ends in Harmony Twp.
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> Ed
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org
>> [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounce at lists.dementix.org] On Behalf Of
>> Stephen
>> Titchenal
>> Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 12:48 PM
>> To: pittsburgh-railways at dementix.org
>> Subject: [PRCo] Beaver Valley Transit
>>
>> I'm trying to locate the route of the Beaver Valley Transit System in the
>> Ambridge - Edgeworth area.
>> Attached is a kmz (Google Earth file) and a screen shot with my best guess
>> based on information from Beaver County Trolleys (Rohrbeck 1985) and
>> various
>> historic topos, aerials and county maps.
>>
>> What was the route through Ambridge? Rohrbeck's map shows it leaving
>> Beaver
>> Rd/Duss Ave for Merchant St. My guess was using 14th St., because 11th was
>> not yet built based on the 1908 topo. It is also possible that BVT used
>> its
>> own right-of-way.
>>
>> Where did it end in Leetsdale/Edgeworth?
>>
>> I am not sure when State St/Duss Ave/Beaver Rd was straightened south of
>> Baden. The early maps show a jog east near current Ehman Ave. Was BVT's
>> route changed? Rohrbeck's map does not show the jog, but the topo and
>> county
>> maps do.
>>
>> In the Beaver Falls area the original bridge used by the BVT across the
>> Beaver River (Bridge St to 3rd Ave) must have been removed at the time of
>> the PRR relocation in 1926. How did the BVT cross the river after that?
>>
>> Thanks for any help with sources.
>>
>> If you wish to keep up with my right-of-way research in the Pittsburgh
>> area,
>> I am sharing a Google Map file and updating it irregularly. If you have a
>> smart phone that supports Google Earth, you can add this shared file to
>> your
>> "My Maps" and actually follow it in the field. There are many paths, so
>> the
>> web-based Google Maps does not displays them in sections. It is better to
>> use the kml link to view in Google Earth.
>>
>>
> http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msa=0&msid=204661335735556483333.0004a5a0f22a
>> bfa17cc00
>>
>> This is a continual work in progress, but new sources of information are
>> always welcome. Some routes are more fully researched than others. I am
>> still struggling with the easiest way to manage changes to routes over
>> time.
>> When I convert this to a GIS database, changes will be easier to manage.
>>
>>
>> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
>> -- Type: application/vnd.google-earth.kmz
>> -- Size: 9k (10236 bytes)
>> -- URL :
>>
> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/Beaver%20Valley%20Tracti
>> on.kmz
>>
>>
>> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
>> -- Type: image/jpeg
>> -- Size: 200k (205244 bytes)
>> -- URL :
>>
> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/BeaverValleyTransit.jpg
>>
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>> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
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>> -- Size: 608k (622713 bytes)
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> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/route%20plan%20edgeworth
> %20-%20baden.jpg
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>> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
>> -- Type: image/jpeg
>> -- Size: 518k (530674 bytes)
>> -- URL :
>> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/1923%20Map.jpg
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-- 
Derrick