[PRCo] Re: 4393 Versus 4366

[Herb Brannon]

Are any car house vehicle assignment logs available after 1952?
Who's Dave Hamley?

On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 21:34, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net>wrote:

> After 1953 ten cars were retained for a year or so for emergencies that
> never happened.   Buses were easier.   They were the 4390s.   That's why
> the museum got 4398.  So after the end of 1953 I think we can assume that
> 4393 was scrapped pretty fast.
>
> The person to ask would be Dave Hamley.
>
>
> On Feb 15, 2012, at 9:18 PM, Herb Brannon wrote:
>
> > That's all well and good, however, should fall under the subject of
> Control
> > Systems.
> > I want to know where 4393 and 4366 were assigned during their tenure at
> > PRCo. I know where they were on January 1, 1952. Where were they after
> that?
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 18:03, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Funny thing, Herb.
> >> Normally cars were segregated to barns in Pittsburgh by equipment.   We
> >> all knew which barns had GE PCCs and which had Westinghouse PCCs.
> >>
> >> The yellow cars had a similar scheme.   There were barns that had cars
> >> with K-35 or K-43 controls.   Then there were other barns that had cars
> >> with HL control.   Same as with the PCCs, the idea was to minimize parts
> >> inventory.   And, just like the PCC assignments, Homewood was totally
> mixed
> >> because it was right next door to the central parts room so it didn't
> >> matter.
> >>
> >> What is HL?   For those unfamiliar, HL was a Westinghouse remote control
> >> system, meaning the motorman's controller did not physically handle the
> 600
> >> volt motoring circuits, it instead told a separate controller, usually
> >> mounted in a case under the car, what to do.   Westinghouse used low
> >> voltage lines between the platform controller and the motoring
> controllers.
> >> In HL or AL, the L stood for Line voltage passed through a dropping
> >> resistor to get a low voltage control circuit.  In AB or HB, a battery
> was
> >> used for the control circuit.   The H stood for hand notching, a A for
> >> automatic progression.   Got it?   OK, now most Westinghouse schemes
> used
> >> pneumatic switches to control the actual 600 volt (or 1200 volt)
> circuits,
> >> and they we be mounted so that if you lost air, they would naturally
> open
> >> by gravity.
> >>
> >> General Electric favored solenoid (magnetic) switches instead of air
> >> (pneumatic switches). Almost all of the Westinghouse HL installations in
> >> Pittsburgh were really knock-offs of GE type M control ... they were low
> >> voltage (instead high voltage with GE favored) but they used solenoid
> >> switches instead of pneumatics.  The only possible exception (and I have
> >> never been able to prove this one way or the other), those 6000 series
> late
> >> 1920s experimental cars might have been pneumatic.
> >>
> >> OK, which barns ... Keating was supposedly a drum control barn.   All of
> >> the single-end cars there in my memory were 4700s or 5500s in later
> years.
> >>   I made a stupid assumption that 4366 was therefore a K35 car.  Ooops.
> >> I found a picture of it at 12 Evergreen and guess what?   I can see very
> >> clearly, the HL contactor box under the far end of the car.    What the
> >> blanket-blank caused them to mix cars at Keating unless it was the only
> car
> >> they had available to put there?  In the period up until 1951-52 when
> route
> >> 9 also worked out of Keating, it used a 4200 and all those low 4200s
> that
> >> were still active very late were HL cars also.  Roster pdf file
> attached.
> >> This roster also confirms that 4366 was a HL car; 4393 was a K-35 car.
> >>
> >> Might be when we got to the very bitter end, it didn't matter.   If it
> >> worked, put it there.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
> >> -- Type: application/pdf
> >> -- Size: 184k (188994 bytes)
> >> -- URL : http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/roster.pdf
> >>
> >>
> >> -- Attached file removed by Ecartis and put at URL below --
> >> -- Type: text/plain
> >> -- Size: 2k (2269 bytes)
> >> -- URL :
> http://lists.dementix.org/files/pittsburgh-railways/ecartIFqFm8
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Herb Brannon
> > In Cuyahoga Valley National Park
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>


-- 
Herb Brannon
In Cuyahoga Valley National Park