[PRCo] Cleveland numbers
John Swindler
j_swindler at hotmail.com
Sun Nov 24 19:42:40 EST 2013
I'll have to ask the former Houston general manager how riders are really counted. - he organized the TRB tour.
> From: fwschneider at comcast.net
> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2013 19:14:47 -0500
> To: pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> Subject: [PRCo] Cleveland numbers
>
> Most agencies in industrial areas had increases in the last three years because we were coming out of the recession. Of course if you only look at the last three years, then you miss the large drop in riding at the beginning of the recession.
>
> Cleveland had a drop of perhaps 12 million the year going into the 2010 recession but it appears to be masked by a series break in the counts between 2005 and 2006. A series break is a statistical term when something happens to screw up the data. The information was not sent to APTA for 2006 leading me to suspect that perhaps the guy or gal who was crunching the numbers in 2004 retired and the new person didn't understand how to do it the same way and took several years to get his or her act together. Then in 2008, Cleveland sent in data for both 2006 and 2007. Those 66 and 60 million numbers in 2006 and 2007 look rather fishy. S--t happens.
>
> The true numbers are probably more like a drop to about 52 or 53 million riders in the 2000-2001 recession, then back up to around 57 million through most of the early 200s until we hit the big recession and then down to 44 million.
>
> Here are the total Cleveland numbers (Bus, Rapid, Light Rail and Demand Responsive) since 1995 by year from the APTA website.
>
> 1995: 58.265 million Cleveland city population around 492,000.
> 1996: 58.736 million
> 1997: 60.892 million
> 1998: 60.557 million
> 1999: 59.300 million
> 2000: 59.116 million 2000-2001 Recession Cleveland city population 2000 census 478,403
> 2001: 58.128 million Unemployed in Cleveland number around 45,000.
> 2002: 52.626 million
> 2003: 53.446 million Unemployed in Cleveland area top 60,000
> 2004: 55.419 million
> 2005: 57.026 million
> 2006: 66,602 million Average unemployed in Cleveland about 62,000
> 2007: 60,025 million Average unemployed in Cleveland region around 67,000
> 2008: 57,287 million 2008-2009 recession Average unemployment in Cleveland around 72,000.
> 2009: 49,706 million Unemployment over 80,000 people in Cleveland
> 2010: 44.592 million Average unemployed in Cleveland between 95,000 and 100,000. City population 396,815.
> 2011: 46.175 million Average unemployed in Cleveland about 82,000.
> 2012: 48.152 million Unemployment in Cleveland in the high 70,000 range.
> 2012: looks like a 1/3 of 1% increase
>
> http://www.deptofnumbers.com/unemployment/ohio/cleveland/
>
> Phillip, I trust some agency numbers more than others. Houston, for example, counts light rail passengers as they walk through a light beam in the car doorway. No matter how they pay their fare … pass, cash fare, or simply sneak on … they are counted. PATCO is probably fairly reliable because every rider has a magnetically encoded ticket and they are counted going through the fare gates.
>
> In addition, some counts are just plain lies because the agencies are trying to prove to politicians that they are worth bigger subsidies. Some are accidental lies. Some are misunderstandings of procedures. Some are done by clerks who don't give a rat's ass. Some are excellent.
>
> But, except for the apparent break in the numbers in 2006 and 2007, I have no reason to suspect the continuity of the Cleveland numbers because they mirror what is happening in the economy and with the local population.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:59 PM, PC wrote:
>
> > Mr.Brannon supplied the figures and I believe the website for Cleveland transit is where it was posted. As this was within the last
> > year or two I was surprized because of the recession. I made a point of checking (maybe a news article in Cleveland) and the
> > numbers were positive increase in ridership. I was amazed at the results. It is in the archives of this list but I am not looking for it.
> >
> >
> > Pc
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------
> > On Sun, 11/24/13, Fred Schneider <fwschneider at comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > Subject: Re: [PRCo] *In Pittsburgh...* *......the Greatest City In The U.S.*
> > To: "Western PA Trolley discussion" <pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org>
> > Date: Sunday, November 24, 2013, 8:32 AM
> >
> > Do not know where you find positive
> > Cleveland numbers…..
> >
> > Since it was not posted to the website, I can only believe
> > the year over year steady gains were revenue losses or
> > ridership losses that impressed you.
> >
> > Light rail, aka Shaker Rapid … Peak year was 1948 with
> > 7.437 million. In 1996 they hauled 3.847
> > million. In 2012 it was 2.855 million fares.
> > The 1995 and 2013 numbers were those that the RTA reported
> > to APTA.
> >
> > The heavy rail numbers for 1995 and 2013 sere 5.140 million
> > and 6.240 million. Herb Brannon once told
> > me that the highest average weekday volume before the
> > airport extension was around 50,000 a day … that would be
> > about 15 million a year.
> >
> > Bus numbers for 1995 were 50.2 million and for 2012 38.5
> > million.
> >
> > Overall, including demand responsive riders, it has
> > dropped 10.6 million a year since 1996, not
> > risen. It has dropped 22% while the
> > population has done down about 21% in the same period …
> > cannot tell exactly because we can only extrapolate the the
> > population drop in the intercensal
> > periods. But it looks like its going down
> > proportionally with the loss of people living in
> > Cleveland.
> >
> > Here is the APTA website:
> >
> > http://www.apta.com/resources/statistics/Pages/ridershipreport.aspx
> >
> > On Nov 24, 2013, at 8:10 AM, PC wrote:
> >
> >> I was very much impressed with Cleveland transit
> > statistics Mr.Brannon; they realized year over year steady
> > gains. One would suspect such to be 'a' measure
> >> of economic health--people traveling back and forth to
> > work and-or to shopping. Yet the situation for the
> > nation is still bad; maybe Cleveland is still doing better
> > than the
> >> average nationally.
> >>
> >> The city has received some bad press with the women
> > captives recently released and negative police
> > reports. But such is possible most anywhere today.
> >>
> >> I have not been in Pgh in decades. I shall look
> > into these books.
> >>
> >>
> >> Phil
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pittsburgh-railways mailing list
> > Pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> > https://mailman.dementix.org/mailman/listinfo/pittsburgh-railways
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pittsburgh-railways mailing list
> > Pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> > https://mailman.dementix.org/mailman/listinfo/pittsburgh-railways
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pittsburgh-railways mailing list
> Pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> https://mailman.dementix.org/mailman/listinfo/pittsburgh-railways
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.dementix.org/pipermail/pittsburgh-railways/attachments/20131124/44c6f8ff/attachment.html
More information about the Pittsburgh-railways
mailing list