[PRCo] Re: Braking Systems

[James B. Holland]

Fred Schneider wrote:
.

> Yes. Broken motor lead so the dynamic brakes failed. Because they 
> failed, all the motorman had was drum brakes. He was young, 
> inadequately trained, and didn't understand why he was sliding through 
> all the stops on the way in that morning. And the problem was 
> compounded because PAT removed the timed derail at South Hills 
> Junction .... had it been there, the car would probably have been on 
> the ground at the top of the hill instead of slamming into the P&LE 
> station. But if memories are short and we can't remember that we had 
> two previous runaways in the tunnel, well, you get the picture.
>
> On Oct 19, 2005, at 12:37 PM, Boris Cefer wrote:
>
>> Perhaps the most tragic story of a streetcar which lost its brakes 
>> (well, in the PCC era) was an accident of 1727 at Station square on 
>> 28th October 1987.
>> It was discussed on this list several years back, but others may add 
>> some details again.
>>
>> Boris
>
.
You are Leaving Out the Most Important Part of the Story.
.
The Operator was  -*Told-*  that he had new trucks on the car with Newly 
Machined Tires and that these Newly Machined Tires would have a Great 
Propensity to Slip / Slide in Both Acceleration and Braking on wet 
rails.       The Operator was a veteran of  ({[pat]})  but only had 
6-months experience on rails.       So when the car slipped and slid as 
predicted, What Would A Novice To Rails Think in this specific situation?
.
Other ops here in SF were impressed that I caught on so fast to sticking 
drums  --  NEVER  experienced such anywhere but SF and in several weeks 
of training here that happened a Multitude of Times.
.
Very Easy to state that the  ({[pat]})  Op was negligent with Our 
Hindsight but in Reality, Would I Personally have recognized the 
difference between a slide from new wheels or lack of brakes because of 
a loss of dynamics and worn out drums As A New Railfan Operator under 
these conditions??       I would like to say Yes but I Can  NOT  do so 
with any authority nor guarantee!!!!!!!       I  AM  quite familiar with 
the hiss of sliding wheels, even on PRCo, so the lack of same in this 
1727 incident may have given me a clue.       Also, remember that it was 
Verboten to use sand unless dire emergency on the Interurban prw  --  
wasn't this a Library Car?!       And with the lack of anything to hit 
on prw, an emergency did not exist!       Using sand and then still 
sliding would have been another clue that Something Else Was Amiss!! 
      (Also, what many people Never Understand  --  necessary to have 
sand  UNDER  ALL  WHEELS  before hitting brakes to prevent a slide  --  
hitting sander and brakes At Same Time rarely does the job!!!!!!!)
.
The Operator in this case was listed as an Hero because, once he 
realized the car was out of control in the tunnel, he had everyone move 
to the rear of the car and one woman who was frozen in fear in her seat, 
this woman He Picked Up And Carried To The Rear of the car.       
Injuries  --  but everyone survived, yes?
.
What about the double-ender that ran away in the tunnel Christmas Eve 
with packed Car  --  argument between op and motorman  --  trolley pole 
dewired and conductor couldn't get out to attend to same  --  op mad 
that he had to do work of someone else  --  also inebriated  --  can't 
find info on this one offhand  --  1917???????
.
.
Here is an edited listing of  some  scrappings due to accidents  --  
4300s Good(?) showing here:::::::

3702   1943.01.18   Collision and Fire Walthers Stop

3709   1943.01.18   Collision and Fire Walthers Stop

4210   1944.08.01   Collision, Castle Shannon

4318   1942.03.20   Fire on the road.

4328   1945.01.24   Damage by locomotive.

4346   1945.07.14   Fire on the road.

4355   1951.11.03   Collision at Washington.

4356   1951.12.29   Fire at Tylderdale.

4364   1944.08.15   Collision with 1410 Ardmore Blvd.

4365   1950.09.18   Collision

4368   1945.05.15   Collision Tunnel

4378   1951.09.14   Collision with truck

4381   1951.08.07?   Collision

4386   1951.08.07?   Collision

4390   1952.05.19   Collision on Charter
                                     apparently Not  PERC.

4708   1943.11.15   Collision Tunnel

4776   1928.12.06   Demolished in Collision

4800   1951.10.29   Collision

4801   1948.09.28   Collision with 5409

4887   1938.01.27   Collision E.Pgh.

5018   1944.11.14   Collision with 1226 Munhall loop

5077   1931.01.02   Run away on Liberty Ave. Hill, car demolished  
(I......City Brewery)

5247   1948.03.12   Badly damaged in derailment.

5409   1948.09.28   Collision with 4801.

1038   1959.xx.xx   Collision with truck 28th Liberty
                         Thought it was Penn - may have snoozepaper
                         article.

1213   1961.xx.xx   Collision SHJ

1242   1960.xx.xx   Collision with M0283, Dawn Jct.

1261   1963.07.08   Collision with 1645 38A.

1267   1962.11.26   Collision with 140-0 Smithfield Bridge

1297   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision with truck Ohio Federal

1299   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision with truck Ohio Brighton

1437   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision

1454   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision

1529   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision with truck lower Forbes

1608   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision with auto Wilkinsburg

1629   1958.04.23   Collision with 1296 Sandusky Gen Robinson

1645   1963.07.08   Collision with 1261 38A - Knew this Operator.

1668   xxxx.xx.xx   Collision inside Tunnel


The following equipment was scrapped because of Homewood Fire::

4131
4826
4851
1026
1051
1155
1220
1281
1294
1600
1648
1682
1701
1725
M0197




Jim__Holland


I__Like__Ike.......And__PCCs!!

down with pantographs ---- UP___WITH___TROLLEYPOLES!!!!!!!