[PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum

Fri Jul 19 14:41:48 EDT 2013

John

But nothing has yet been said about when Seashore regauged or retrucked the car. It is not necessarily true that because the acquired the car in the 60s that they did the conversion right away.  AIR it took Branford a decade or more to retruck their PSTC car.  I don’t know the answer to that.  But is it not true that by the 1970s the first replacement of CTA PCC rapid cars was in progress?  I seem to recall that Leonard Brothers bought several sets from them as spares for their subway operation—it could have been in the 80s though.  But so could Seashore’s conversion.  Unless we ask someone from there when it was done, and how, we are just speculating. 

But that is something we are good at!

Dwight

From: John Swindler 
Sent: Friday, 19 July, 2013 13:30
To: Western PA Trolley discussion 
Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum

Except CTA was not scrapping PCC rapid transit cars in 1960s, and Boston (figuratively) was just around the corner.  

This is somewhat of a sequel to previous thread about B&O overnight trains.  If CTA gives a system pass to a railfan employee, he'll spend his time-off riding and photographing 4000s on the northside 'el'.  

> From: dwightlong at verizon.net
> To: pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2013 13:07:54 -0400
> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> 
> 
> Fred
> 
> But who’s to say they did not buy a set or sets of trucks in advance?  Also, could not Chicago PCC rapid car trucks be used—of course air brakes would have to be fitted.
> 
> Dwight
> 
> 
> From: Fred Schneider 
> Sent: Friday, 19 July, 2013 11:57
> To: Western PA Trolley discussion 
> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> You would have had to cut the extension rings off the axle housings.   Put bearings in the end of the shorter axle housings if they had a place to put them.   Install shorter axles.   Then, since this is an air car, you would need to fabricate new, shorter brake beams.   It would be a lot easier than a outside framed truck ….
> 
> BUT IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN A WHOLE LOT EASIER TO FIND A PAIR OF TRUCKS OF THE RIGHT GAUGE IN THE SCRAP HEAP SOMEWHERE ELSE.    That car would have come to Seashore in the mid to late 1960s.   The Montreal cars were gone in 1959.   Washington's cars were gone by 1962.   But Boston may have had standard gauge air cards then and one of the Seashore members worked for MTA / MBTA in the shops.   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Jul 19, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Lattner, Raymond wrote:
> 
> > I thought the book, PCC the Car That Fought Back, indicated it was relatively easy to change the gauge of the trucks? 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: pittsburgh-railways-bounces at mailman.dementix.org [mailto:pittsburgh-railways-bounces at mailman.dementix.org] On Behalf Of John Swindler
> > Sent: Friday, July 19, 2013 9:38 AM
> > To: Western PA Trolley discussion
> > Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > We tend to use the term 're-gauge', which implies modifying the original trucks.  But suspect it would be a lot cheaper to swap for trucks that are already standard gauge.  In the end, same difference - 1440 is operable on Seashore track, only quicker and cheaper.  
> > 
> > PTM has the opposite problem - finding broad gauge trucks to fit under standard gauge equipment without going to expense of re-gauging.  I suspect the Boston dump car is an example.  However, the open car did not lend itself to an easy expedient.   
> > 
> > Never paid much attention to re-gauging issues until the Trolley Fare accounts on work that had to be done for several recent PTM acquisitions. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> From: dwightlong at verizon.net
> >> To: pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> >> Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2013 03:20:42 -0400
> >> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> >> 
> >> 
> >> John
> >> 
> >> Perhaps so they could operate it on their standard gauge track?  What am I missing in this question?
> >> 
> >> Dwight
> >> 
> >> From: John Swindler
> >> Sent: Thursday, 18 July, 2013 21:51
> >> To: Western PA Trolley discussion
> >> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> >> 
> >> 
> >> huh, Fred???
> >> 
> >> Alan Pegler never had a Royal Scot.  Those were London-Midland-Scottish 4-6-0 types used on the West Coast main line.  The first one - #6100 Royal Scot  has been preserved.  
> >> 
> >> The "Flying Scotsman" is an  A-3 class London and Northeastern 'pacific' type loco used on the East Coast main line.
> >> 
> >> The only similarity is that both made trips to US, but neither you nor I ever saw the Royal Scot in this country - it's US visit was during 1930s.
> >> 
> >> As for PRC 1440, finding this link falls into the category of just dumb luck.  Any reason Seashore would re-gauge the PRC trucks rather than use an extra set of Boston PCC trucks????
> >> 
> >> http://www.trolleymuseum.org/collection/browse.php?id=01440SPA
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >>> From: fwschneider at comcast.net
> >>> Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 19:49:27 -0400
> >>> To: pittsburgh-railways at mailman.dementix.org
> >>> Subject: Re: [PRCo] PRC 1400 Series PCC in Museum
> >>> 
> >>> Here is a link to 1440 on Seashore's web site.
> >>> 
> >>> http://www.trolleymuseum.org/collection/browse.php?id=01440SPA
> >>> 
> >>> I have no idea what shape it is in today.  Remember when Alan Pegler's Royal Scot  (4472) was running in the U. S. A?    I think it is called the Flying Scotsman today and there is a joke on line about renaming it after the prime minister by simply removing the F from the name.  
> >>> 
> >>> Well, I think that might have been about 1969.   I went up on the Night Clunker from Philly to Providence and met Bill Middleton (the Navy had him in Newport, RI then) and we spent the weekend chasing a British steam engine and riding trolleys at Seashore.   That was the only time I saw 1440 and it looked pretty good them.    I have been up that way one or two times since but I didn't see it out.
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> On Jul 18, 2013, at 4:39 PM, Edward H. Lybarger wrote:
> >>> 
> >>>> It was operable at that time.  I presume it still is...can't find a photo of it -- or most other cars -- on their website.
> >>>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> _______________________________________________
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